Viet Nam and Afghanistan make clear that military power requires appropriate and correct understanding, use, context, and goals to be useful. In the US, and with respect to Viet Nam, there is an argument to be made that US planners were ignorant of Viet Nam's history, which includes almost 2,000 years in which they mostly successfully kept the Chinese out of Viet Nam. That is, in fighting the Chinese, and the French and the Japanese and the US (and each other when they could), they were simply doing what they culturally had to and knew how to do. The Chinese do not have available to them the excuse that they are ignorant of that history - although they may forget it. Which is to say that they are probably mindful that at least for the time being attacking Taiwan would be too costly an adventure.

At the same time China's own more recent history can partly explain its bellicose posturing. No question the Chinese are intelligent: but how smart an altogether different question. In any case a bear to be sure, and as with any bear, some space must - will - be made for it. Of interest is how they will get along on their border with India.

I more or less agree with your post, while China wants to take over Taiwan it is unlikely for them to do so with military action and if they DO take military action the negative consequences for them in doing so will likely be so disadvantageous that it wouldn't be worth anything they get for taking Taiwan. In other words, it might be a worse experience for them than what happened in Viet Nam for the US.

However, China it seems lately to be willing to take actions against their neighbors such as Australia (such as in cyber attacks and sending military vessels near their coast) as a way of demonstrating their belief that they ARE the dominate superpower in Asia and that they believe that there is nothing anyone can do to stop this. Of course, such actions haven't gone unnoticed and right now Australia and China are not as friendly with each other as they use to be. It is plausible that such actions were miscalculations on the behalf of Chinese leadership, but if they are willing to blunder into such actions as to make friendly countries a lot less friendly with them than it is plausible blunders on their part could eventually turn the cold war they have started with West and her allies into more of a hot war.

Right now, they seem to be content with their sabre rattling and rhetoric of bring fire and brimstone to anyone that isn't willing to kowtow to the power that be in China but it is unknown how long they will be happy saying such things and at what point they are really willing to back up their words with real action.

As I mentioned before it seems like China isn't really ready to back up their words with action, but from what little I know they are doing everything in their power to beef up their army, navy, and air force in a way to make it seem like they might be more ready in the future to act. Also there is an issue with their economy where it seems like they intend to be the most powerful economic superpower in the world in the upcoming years. I don't know what power they will gain from either or both moves, but something tells me if they are doing so much preparations in trying to undermine the US and her allies at the present that it is unlikely that they will continue to sit on their hands in the coming decades with some move to show off to the West their military/economic might in the hopes that the US and other countries will either back down or even bow down to China.

While it isn't a given this will happen, I believe that history has shown that when a country spends a lot of money on military build up (often at the expense of domestic projects) that the leaders of such countries are kind of under pressure for them to try and start solving problems through military force (instead of relying on diplomatic means), and the issue of the possible negative outcome of such actions are no longer as important as they once were.

I think the days of superpowers are over, thank goodness. Countries that were traditionally poor and powerless are now gaining economic and political strength. Everyone is connected to everyone else by economic ties. We can't screw them without screwing ourselves.

China is just starting to act like we do. Yes, that could be a frightening prospect.

China is just starting to act like we do. Yes, that could be a frightening prospect. — T Clark

This is what scares me about China:
https://www.businessinsider.com/china-social-credit-system-punishments-and-rewards-explained-2018-4

I think the days of superpowers are over, thank goodness. Countries that were traditionally poor and powerless are now gaining economic and political strength. Everyone is connected to everyone else by economic ties. We can't screw them without screwing ourselves.

China is just starting to act like we do. Yes, that could be a frightening prospect. — T Clark

The US may not be the nicest superpower to ever exist, but I would have to agree with other forum members that it is better for a world to be protected by the US then ruled under China.

Living in China right now people can be detained and jailed indefinitely just because someone claims that they are a dissident or enemy of the state. I don't know if it is as bad as North Korea with their concentration camps, but it is likely not that much better.

Take for a moment to imagine somehow North Korea became as powerful as China and started flexing it's military muscles and started talking about attacking South Korea and perhaps Japan as well if the US and her allies didn't just let them seize South Korea and whatever territory they wanted to. While it is a given that any military aggression by North Korea would be confronted by forces by either US and her allies the very idea of your country being taken over and having to live under thumb of the North Korean dictator would be about as terrifying for any democratic country in Asia as it would be for any European country to be taken over by either Hitler or Stalin when either of them were alive.

While China may not be quite as bad as North Korea at the moment, they are increasingly hostile and threatening to their neighboring countries. They have even managed to alienate Australia through cyber attacks and military action who they use to have much better relations with. Any country they manage to take over would have their government replaced with a puppet one from China and the country would no longer be a country but merely another subservient state under the rule of China.

In a nutshell if China manages to become the biggest super power in the world and nobody can or will stop them, they will just keep swallowing one country after another until either most or all of the world is under the authoritarian rule of China itself. While some people claim that living in a world under US rule is kind of like living under either authoritarian rule or under some neo-feudalism, I'm pretty certain that living under Chinese rule with people in charge like the current authorities in China would be much, much worse and the people living under such conditions and people would be treated not that better than animals as their only existence would be to serve the state, much like those that are forced to live in North Korea.

This is what scares me about China:
https://www.businessinsider.com/china-social-credit-system-punishments-and-rewards-explained-2018-4 — RogueAI

Yeah, I've hear about this before where China is trying to use IT technology to turn their cities into police states instead of using it to try and make peoples lives better. In the US you can have trouble getting certain jobs if you have a bad credit score, but at least the city and state authorities that are here don't use it to "identify troublemakers". The problem with using credit scores to identify "good"/"bad" people is that credit scores are really just a reflection of a persons financial status and not criminal/moral behavior since ALOT of law abiding people who never have committed a crime in their lives can have really bad credit scores if they either have a medical emergency and/or lose their job and unable to quickly acquire a new one.

Maybe their is a difference between "credit scores" in the US and China, but if they are not then it would be a bit unethical to judge citizens with bad credit scores as trouble makers if the reason for having a bad score was because of financial problems. Of course often in a police state being "poor" can be a crime in and of itself and because of this it wouldn't matter if one was a law abiding citizen but had financial issues since the fact that they are unable to produce wealth themselves could or would be not better than the actions of a common criminal. Welcome to the new "new world order".

In a nutshell if China manages to become the biggest super power in the world and nobody can or will stop them, they will just keep swallowing one country after another until either most or all of the world is under the authoritarian rule of China itself. — dclements

I haven't seen anyone else seriously claim that the Chinese authorities have any such plan, or that it's a remotely probable scenario. Where do you get the idea from?

The US may not be the nicest superpower to ever exist, but I would have to agree with other forum members that it is better for a world to be protected by the US then ruled under China. — dclements

The more stable situation would be to have the influence of both.

In a nutshell if China manages to become the biggest super power in the world and nobody can or will stop them, they will just keep swallowing one country after another until either most or all of the world is under the authoritarian rule of China itself. — dclements

This is the lie we told ourselves when we got into Vietnam. As I said, I think the days of superpowers are over. We'll see. Well, not me, I'll be dead by then.

I haven't seen anyone else seriously claim that the Chinese authorities have any such plan, or that it's a remotely probable scenario. Where do you get the idea from? — jamalrob

Do you have doubts that China if given the opportunity wouldn't use any military advantage it has to become the most influential super power in the Asia-Pacific and after becoming the most powerful country in that area then wouldn't work toward becoming the most powerful country in the world?

One could say that once upon a time China was mostly just interested in maintaining it's borders and merely defending itself from potential outside threats, but that is no longer the case. China now is trying to build up a military that potentially could one day rival that in the US and/or could potentially take on both the US and her allies at once. It may seem inconceivable that any country that wants to build up a military as big as the US would naturally want to challenge them, but it kind of works that way because if you have a big military it is almost a given you want to do something with it. And it is pretty much a given that China has some scores to settle after the last few hundred years where they where more victims of various wars then the other way around.

Also after you somehow manage to get extra territory through either political or military means it often emboldens one's leaders as to figure out what other territory may need to be taken in order to further their own national interest. While China may not be particularly interested in any other land than Taiwan at the moment, they are interested in taking over any territory which may help undermine the US and her allies while at the same time strengthening their own economy.

In a nutshell, all they want to do is find a way further political/military/economical agenda while at the same time undermine US/Western influence in the region at the same time. However in doing so they have set themselves on a collision course with Western countries and their allies, and on top of that they have mad verbal threats and military action against allies in the region. One may like to think of it as some kind of "peaceful" rabble rousing that China's is doing in order to get more "respect" from other, but if you lived in a country where someone from China told you that you need to kowtow before China unless you want to be blown to tiny bits by Chinese bombs, you may not think of China as the nice friendly China that you may envision them to be.

Also it is pretty much a given that if one wants to be the largest superpower in the world, it is unlikely one can do so by other countries merely peacefully accepting your desire to take them over and everyone just happily singing "Kumbaya" when you are done. A while back China had better political relations with neighboring countries such as Austria when all China seemed to want was beneficial trade relations with other countries, but when Austria realized that China was making great efforts to spy on them through cybercrimes that friendship got a lot colder. While it may not seem a big deal to be spying, and taking other actions with a friendly country in which you have good trade relationships with, it kind of makes one wonder what China is willing to do with countries that they don't even have good relationships with yet.

The bottom line is that China is expending an incredible effort to build up it's military and trying to command respect for other countries in order for people in said countries to recognize it's "authority" in certain matters since now it considers itself the world next greatness superpower. Whether or not it will be able to command such respect in the coming years, it is almost already a given that it thinks other countries should not interfere in any of it's plans..or else. While it hasn't exactly lived up to all of the threats they have made, it is hard not to believe that they would go through with them if they could. And the biggest obstacle in for them being able to just follow through with all of their current plans is many the US and her allies. I don't know about you but if I considered myself the world's biggest superpower and I needed to show other countries they need to kowtow before me, I would use the resources at my disposal to make an example of any country that is trying to undermine my counties authority. Of course that is IF my country was indeed the world greatest superpower and I wasn't just making hollow threats that I could back up with action.

The more stable situation would be to have the influence of both. — frank

When I was young and before the Cold War ended, I use to think that in some way the USSR kept the US in check and the US kept the USSR in check. And with two separate superpowers with different ideology neither the forces of capitalism nor communism could become truly the dominant ideology in the world. Of course this changed when the Cold War ended.

Today it seems like capitalism has de-evolved into something more like plutocracy or neo-feudalism than democratic capitalism it use to be (that is if it even was ever that). But if you look at China instead of it being communist it itself has de-evolved into authoritarianism. Because of this, it is no longer really a conflict of ideology like the last Cold War but more merely about how the richest and most people in the world will decide how to carve up the world among themselves and how they will treat and rule the pleebs beneath them.

Because of this, there is no real benefit from China trying to wrestle control with the West.

This is the lie we told ourselves when we got into Vietnam. As I said, I think the days of superpowers are over. We'll see. Well, not me, I'll be dead by then. — T Clark

Well the real lie in many of our wars that it was really about certain rich men becoming richer at the expense of those that fought and suffer during such wars, however this can be said of almost all wars that are fought.

While the idea of having one (or more) super powers trying to act like a world cop doesn't sound all that great with all the problems that can be cause by this, neither is the idea of dozens and dozens of smaller countries always bickering and often fighting in order to either change or maintain the existing status quo. It isn't a given the former is always better than the latter, but I think as a rule of thumb it is more often harder when dealing with the latter since one's existence is often threaten by hostile neighbors who are almost always thinking of ways of coming over, taking over, and/or stealing your lunch in one form or another.

I guess such is the nature of man and conflicts since the beginning of time.

While the idea of having one (or more) super powers trying to act like a world cop doesn't sound all that great with all the problems that can be cause by this, neither is the idea of dozens and dozens of smaller countries always bickering and often fighting in order to either change or maintain the existing status quo. — dclements

Strongly disagree. I think the world without a superpower is where we're headed, and that's a good thing.

A while back China had better political relations with neighboring countries such as Austria — dclements

:chin:

Otherwise, your reply does not make anything close to a case for the claim that the Chinese intend to "swallow up one country after another", as you put it.

Only Superman has superpowers, but Commieman is everywhere at once.

If one is a "freethinker", it should be possible to step out of the mythology of one's culture of origin, but perhaps the myth of the freethinking individual is the hardest myth to step out of. Should we consider the end of the US as a superpower, as the triumph of the free individual, or his defeat?

Now, I'm liberal, to a degree
I want ev'rybody to be free
But if you think that I'd let Barry Goldwater
Move in next door or marry my daughter
You must think I'm crazy
I wouldn't let him do it for all the farms in Cuba. — I Shall be Free no.10

A philosopher might question whether it is even coherent that The Land of the Free is the dominant superpower. Or is that part of the doublethink by which control is maintained?

Strongly disagree. I think the world without a superpower is where we're headed, and that's a good thing. — T Clark

I disagree with your disagreement. We still live in a world where might almost makes right and that has not changed since either the end of World War II and/or the Cold War. I don't know what makes you believe that either military and/or economic power is irrelevant anymore and the ability of any given country can think and claim they are a superpower because of it, but it seems obvious that the relevance of discussions as to whom is and isn't one should make it clear the importance of such economic/military capacity.

There is a quote from the movie "They Live" that goes something along the lines of "He who has the gold makes the rules" which roughly translates into "He who has power makes the rules which others have to live by". The latter more or less applies to the differences between those that are a superpower and those who are not.

I don't know if it is just wishful thinking on your part or if you have some valid reason why being a superpower isn't important but from where I'm sitting, I can't see a world where there either isn't superpower countries throwing their weight around or countries trying to build up the armies in order for them to have some kind of quasi-superpower status. I'm sure one could argue that it would be "nicer' if the nature of man was different and all of mankind could work together as one, but that is NOT the kind of world we currently live in. Perhaps if our world was threaten by some kind of alien race that wished to take over our world, maybe our differences would become moot and the entire human race would no longer squabble over who has what since our very existence could be on the line. However it isn't a given that such a situation would be that much better than the one we are already in.

:chin:

Otherwise, your reply does not make anything close to a case for the claim that the Chinese intend to "swallow up one country after another", as you put it. — jamalrob

I guess you forgot about the fact that China is threating military action against Taiwan if Taiwan doesn't surrender to China in the near future. Also they are doing everything and anything they can to take over islands in Pacific through either political pressure or money, as well as threating India and other neighboring countries. Also China is trying to gain power in Africa, as well as trying to use computer espionage in any country they can in order to gain some leverage over whatever/whomever they can.

Here are some videos to give you an idea of what is really going on:

























Hopefully after you watch all these videos you will have a better idea of what China is trying to do.

I disagree with your disagreement. — dclements

Many people disagree with many of my disagreements. No surprise. You and I see things differently. I've seen the trouble fear will get us into.

the movie "They Live" — dclements

Love this movie. I think Rowdy Roddy Piper got an Oscar nomination. Didn't he? On the other hand, I don't plan to develop my foreign policy opinions based on it.

I don't know if it is just wishful thinking on your part or if you have some valid reason why being a superpower isn't important — dclements

As I noted, I don't think it makes any difference what you and I think is best. I think the days of superpowers are over, whether we like it or not.

The bottom line is even if China isn't able or willing to use military action to get what it wants in the near future, in the coming decades will it be able to use it's economic and/or military might to get whatever it wants and be able to eventually even push the US and her allies into a corner and make it so that the rest of world has to allow China to whatever it wants and eventually allow China to surpass the US as the world's major superpower? — dclements

I think China is already trying to do that and it will only stop if the international community takes concerted action to stop it.

The European Union has just announced a €300bn fund to counteract growing Chinese influence:

EU launches €300bn fund to challenge China’s influence – BBC News

The head of British intelligence has said that China is now the biggest external threat on account of its aggressive foreign policy including espionage and subversive economic activities:

China now our biggest priority, says head of MI6 – The Times

China is trapping poor nations with data snares and debt, says MI6 chief – The Times

And anti-China resistance is growing in Africa, India, and elsewhere:

China calls on citizens to leave eastern Congo after attacks – AP

So, there seems to be growing awareness of the danger posed by China's foreign policy and a certain degree of willingness to put up resistance.

The only problem is that if the West keeps putting pressure on Russia by constantly expanding NATO and interfering in Ukraine and elsewhere, Russia will see itself forced to side with China against the West.

A more logical approach would be for the West to form a united front with Russia, India, Japan, and Africa to stop China's growing economic expansionism and militarism.

Is China going to surpass the US and become the world's most powerful superpower?

It already has.

For you it is. For the rest of the world, China is a regional power.

Hopefully after you watch all these videos you will have a better idea of what China is trying to do. — dclements

Thanks!

I guess you forgot about the fact that China is threating military action against Taiwan if Taiwan doesn't surrender to China in the near future. Also they are doing everything and anything they can to take over islands in Pacific through either political pressure or money, as well as threating India and other neighboring countries. Also China is trying to gain power in Africa, as well as trying to use computer espionage in any country they can in order to gain some leverage over whatever/whomever they can. — dclements

So...

1. The People's Republic of China wants to get the Republic of China back, and will use bullying and coercion to do it.
2. It wants some islands in its vicinity, for trade and control and regional dominance and all that.
3. The Chinese are exploiting Africans in the context of global capitalism.
4. They're doing espionage.

None of this backs up your statement. I don't approve of what they're doing and how they do it, but their foreign adventures are nothing in comparison with those of some other countries. In any case, none of it shows that they intend to actually invade and "swallow up" the rest of the world, as you claimed. That is just your frenzied fantasy. Taiwan is obviously a special case.

Since that discussion has been been more or less exhausted as to what could be talked about, I thought it might be better to discuss a even bigger issue of China's desire to become the dominant super power in the world and whether they can achieve such a goal. — dclements

I think China has the potential to become the new American right-wing bogeyman that keeps us dumping 700 billion tax dollars into a peacetime war machine while children starve, bridges collapse, and public education devolves into for profit bible schools.

Many people disagree with many of my disagreements. No surprise. You and I see things differently. I've seen the trouble fear will get us into. — T Clark

When I said I disagree with your disagreement I was kind of just trying to be cute. I could be wrong but certain amount of fear is warranted in the case of dealing with China since they are nearly doing everything in their power to under the US and her allies in the Asia- Pacific region as well as else where. This might sound like the typical far mongering spewed from the West whenever they need a reason to spend more on their military and/or flex their military muscle, but China posses a larger threat then the terrorist in the middle east could EVER pose to the world. When I was younger I never thought it was really necessary to invade and/or start wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc just because they hold either oil or other strategic interest to the US but I don't think it is an option for the US and her allies to just sit on their hands after the actions they have taken in the recent years..

Love this movie. I think Rowdy Roddy Piper got an Oscar nomination. Didn't he? On the other hand, I don't plan to develop my foreign policy opinions based on it. — T Clark

You misread my post, it has really nothing to do with the movie and more about the problem of the misuse of power and the fact that those who often have almost all the power think that "might makes right" and that they are not accountable to the crimes they commit because they have to much power for anyone to hold them accountable. I could be wrong but I think you know the difference between living in a democracy from living in an authoritarian or military dictatorship. While the US and some of her allies don't really have a true democracy anymore (that is if there ever was one), they are still better then living under a military dictatorship that Hong Kong is under and what other countries will be like if China ever can get their hands on them,

As I noted, I don't think it makes any difference what you and I think is best. I think the days of superpowers are over, whether we like it or not — T Clark

Well I agree with you that we are merely plebs to the larger powers that be so are opinions are not really as relevant as those who could do something about it, unless either we can influence someone who can do something or enough of us plebs have a better understanding of the situation.

I have done my best to try to explain my position on why countries who have super power status (as well as the allies that support them) still make a difference in the world. However I have seen nothing in your posts to explain why you believe that the "days of superpowers are over" other than that is your opinion. As 180 Proof (another forum member) has often pointed out on this and other forums "positions not backed by any proof can be easily dismissed without any proof", and since you seem to be either unable or unwilling to explain why you believe what you are saying I have to assume it is merely a position that isn't backed by anything other than your mere opinion.

So...

1. The People's Republic of China wants to get the Republic of China back, and will use bullying and coercion to do it.
2. It wants some islands in its vicinity, for trade and control and regional dominance and all that.
3. The Chinese are exploiting Africans in the context of global capitalism.
4. They're doing espionage.

None of this backs up your statement. I don't approve of what they're doing and how they do it, but their foreign adventures are nothing in comparison with those of some other countries. In any case, none of it shows that they intend to actually invade and "swallow up" the rest of the world, as you claimed. That is just your frenzied fantasy. Taiwan is obviously a special case. — jamalrob

I could be wrong but your views are not all that different than some of those in Britain who wanted to avoid another war with Germany before World War II and who wanted to try a diplomatic tactic of "appeasement" with Hitler and Nazi Germany. I don't know if you realize it but the failure of not doing enough early on in the war pretty much had a catastrophic cost to England and in the end England was no longer the global super power is was before the war.

While it is unlikely the US and her allies in the region will make the same mistake England made with Hitler, it is almost all but a given that China is more than willing to do whatever it takes (other than perhaps having a full confrontation with the US and her allies) to seize control in the region. While China doesn't seem that threatening at the moment to you because of the US presence, a question you might what to ask yourself would you be happy and comfortable living in either Taiwan, Japan, or Australia right if there wasn't any US presence and the country you were in (as well as the people in it) had to deal with China's efforts to expand their domain and their willingness to use a military option if the country you were in wasn't willing to kowtow to ever whim or desire the China had for it. I could be wrong but I think you would be in an entirely different mindset if you were in that position and not the one you are currently in.

I think China is already trying to do that and it will only stop if the international community takes concerted action to stop it.

The European Union has just announced a €300bn fund to counteract growing Chinese influence:

EU launches €300bn fund to challenge China’s influence – BBC News

The head of British intelligence has said that China is now the biggest external threat on account of its aggressive foreign policy including espionage and subversive economic activities:

China now our biggest priority, says head of MI6 – The Times

China is trapping poor nations with data snares and debt, says MI6 chief – The Times

And anti-China resistance is growing in Africa, India, and elsewhere:

China calls on citizens to leave eastern Congo after attacks – AP

So, there seems to be growing awareness of the danger posed by China's foreign policy and a certain degree of willingness to put up resistance.

The only problem is that if the West keeps putting pressure on Russia by constantly expanding NATO and interfering in Ukraine and elsewhere, Russia will see itself forced to side with China against the West.

A more logical approach would be for the West to form a united front with Russia, India, Japan, and Africa to stop China's growing economic expansionism and militarism. — Apollodorus

Excellent post! :D

I more or less agree with everything you said and applaud the fact you also pointed out some of the issues I haven't gotten around to point out myself. You are clearly someone who has done some due diligence on the subject and is knowledgeable about the current set of circumstances involving China.

To be honest, I have no idea why the West has chosen to continued to have such frosty relations with Russia other than some of the people in our country still think of them the same way we did during the cold war as well as some of the aggressive behavior of Russia since the cold war ended. Perhaps it is just a case of old habits dying hard and politicians on both sides still like to wave their fists at each other in order for them to gain support from their constituents. While China and Russia are currently on friendly terms, I don't think they are friendly enough to aid one another in a war with the US if it is happens that either China or Russia is the one that decides to start one with us. However whether this is true or not remains to be seen.

I believe for a variety of reasons, I believe the US and her allies are making efforts in order so that Russia and China may not be as friendly or get more friendlier with each other. Perhaps this may involve trying to create friendly ties between Russia and the US (and perhaps her allies) but I'm not really aware of what the real goals are since I haven't read up on them.

However I have seen nothing in your posts to explain why you believe that the "days of superpowers are over" other than that is your opinion. — dclements

Perhaps you have "seen nothing... to explain," but I did give an explanation. I guess you missed it.

I think China has the potential to become the new American right-wing bogeyman that keeps us dumping 700 billion tax dollars into a peacetime war machine while children starve, bridges collapse, and public education devolves into for profit bible schools. — Cheshire

Yeah, this problem goes all the way back to the Cold War where the US government always had the issue of whether it was better to invest in either butter or bullets. Since we have almost always had to spend more money on our military than pretty much all other countries combined it is pretty much a given which of the two gets the most attention. I have a feeling that this isn't going to change at any time in the near future.

Guns versus butter model
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guns_versus_butter_model
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/g/gunsandbutter.asp

Perhaps you have "seen nothing... to explain," but I did give an explanation. I guess you missed it. — T Clark

Can you be so kind as to give me a link/point out which post you are referring to? I have looked at all your posts in this thread and all I can see in your posts is more or less you merely stating your opinions without really anything to back them up. Maybe I missed something in one of those post or perhaps you are referring to a post in a different thread, however in either case in would be helpful if would show me where in your posts you put something that supports your position and isn't just a statement of what your beliefs or opinions are.

Yeah, this problem goes all the way back to the Cold War where the US government always had the issue of whether it was better to invest in either butter or bullets. Since we have almost always had to spend more money on our military than pretty much all other countries combined it is pretty much a given which of the two gets the most attention. I have a feeling that this isn't going to change at any time in the near future. — dclements

The "had to" is debatable. We have to in order to prop up a manufacturing sector with inefficient contracts because our consumer goods corporations went overseas to increase their profits. We have 11 aircraft carriers and twice the deck space of the world combined. I think the Chinese government is more concerned with their government not being undermined by appearing weak. Trying to get 1.4 billion people operating under a system that is not tailored to competitive interests is a contest against human nature.