• Moliere
    5.7k
    Wittgenstein's Hinges and Gödel's Unprovable Statements
    By: @Sam26
    Abstract

    In Ludwig Wittgenstein's final notes, published posthumously as On Certainty (1969), Wittgenstein introduces the concept of hinge propositions as foundational certainties that lie beyond justification and doubt (OC 341-343). These certainties support our language-games and epistemic practices, offering a distinctive perspective on knowledge that challenges traditional epistemology's demand for universal justification. I argue for a structural parallel between Wittgenstein's hinges and Gödel's 1931 incompleteness theorems, demonstrating that consistent mathematical systems contain true statements that cannot be proven within those systems. Both thinkers uncover fundamental limits to internal justification: Wittgenstein shows that epistemic systems rest on unjustified certainties embedded in our form of life, while Gödel proves that mathematical systems require axioms that cannot be demonstrated within the system itself. Rather than representing failures of reasoning, these ungrounded foundations serve as necessary conditions that make systematic inquiry possible. This parallel suggests that foundational certainties enable rather than undermine knowledge, pointing to a universal structural feature of how such systems must be grounded. This analysis has implications for reconsidering the nature of certainty across epistemology and the philosophy of mathematics.

    Introduction

    We often perform actions without hesitation, such as sitting on a chair or picking up a pencil, without questioning the existence of either. This unthinking action illustrates Wittgenstein's concept of a hinge proposition, a fundamental certainty that supports our use of language and epistemological language-games. Wittgenstein compares hinge propositions to the hinges that enable a door to function; these certainties provide the underlying support for the structures of language and knowledge, remaining unaffected by the need for justification.

    Wittgenstein's hinges bear a remarkable resemblance to Gödel's incompleteness theorems, revealing unprovable mathematical statements. This resemblance points to deeper questions about how both domains handle foundational issues. Both Wittgenstein and Gödel uncover limits to internal justification, a connection I will examine.

    Traditional epistemology often misinterprets hinges by forcing them into a true/false propositional role, neglecting their foundational status embedded in our epistemic form of life. These bedrock assumptions precede argument or evidence, forming the foundational elements of our epistemic practices. Similarly, Gödel's incompleteness theorems showed that any consistent arithmetic system contains true statements unprovable within the system and cannot demonstrate its own consistency.

    This connection is significant because it highlights the boundary between what counts as bedrock for epistemic and mathematical systems. Both rest on certainties that lie beyond justification, certainties that are not flaws in reasoning but necessary foundations that make knowledge claims possible. This paper argues that ungrounded certainties enable knowledge, rather than undermining it, and that hinges and Gödel's unprovable statements serve a similar purpose. By examining the parallels between Wittgenstein and Gödel, particularly the role of unprovable foundations and the need for external grounding, this paper sheds light on the nature of certainty in our understanding of both epistemology and mathematics.

    Section 1: Hinges and Their Foundational Role

    Wittgenstein's concept of hinge propositions is crucial to his thinking, particularly in the context of epistemology. In On Certainty, Wittgenstein introduces the idea of hinges as certainties that ground our epistemic practices. While Wittgenstein never explicitly distinguishes types of hinges, his examples suggest a distinction between nonlinguistic and linguistic varieties, revealing different levels of fundamental certainties.

    Nonlinguistic hinges represent the most basic level of certainty, bedrock assumptions that ground our actions and interactions with the world. These are not expressed as propositions subject to justification or doubt but embodied in unreflective action. For instance, the certainty that the ground will support us when we walk is a nonlinguistic hinge that enables movement without hesitation. Similarly, our unthinking confidence that objects will behave predictably, that chairs will hold our weight, that pencils will mark paper, represents this bedrock level of certainty. These hinges operate beneath the level of articulation, forming the silent background against which all conscious thought and language become possible.

    Building upon this bedrock foundation, linguistic hinges operate at a more articulated but less fundamental level. These are certainties embedded within our language-games and cultural practices, often taking the form of basic statements like "I have two hands" or "The Earth exists." Unlike nonlinguistic hinges, these can be spoken and seem propositional, yet they resist the usual patterns of justification and doubt. Other examples include statements such as "I am a human being" or "The world has existed for a long time," assertions that appear to convey information but function more as structural supports for discourse than as ordinary claims requiring evidence.

    These two types of hinges show how certainty operates at different levels in grounding knowledge. Nonlinguistic hinges form the deepest stratum, revealing the unquestioned backdrop that makes any form of questioning possible. Linguistic hinges, while still foundational, represent a layer above bedrock that anchors shared discourse within specific contexts. Both types resist justification, but their resistance stems from different sources: nonlinguistic hinges from their pre-rational embodiment in action, linguistic hinges from their structural role within our language-games.

    Wittgenstein breaks with traditional epistemology here. Rather than viewing these certainties as beliefs requiring justification, he recognizes them as the ungrounded ground that makes justification itself possible. He notes, "There is no why. I simply do not. This is how I act" (OC 148). Doubting these hinges would collapse the very framework within which doubt makes sense, like attempting to saw off the branch on which one sits.

    A crucial distinction emerges between subjective and objective dimensions of these certainties. While our relationship to hinges involves unquestioning acceptance, this certainty is not merely psychological. These assumptions are shaped by our interactions with a world that both constrains and enables our practices. The certainty reflected in our actions has an objective component, as it emerges from our shared engagement with reality and proves itself through the successful functioning of our practices.

    This interpretation of hinges as operating at different foundational levels finds support in recent Wittgenstein scholarship, though it diverges from some prominent readings. Danièle Moyal-Sharrock argues that hinges are fundamentally non-propositional, existing as lived certainties rather than beliefs or knowledge claims (Moyal-Sharrock 2004). While my distinction between nonlinguistic and linguistic hinges aligns with her emphasis on the embodied, pre-propositional character of our most basic certainties, I suggest that some hinges do function at a more articulated level within language-games, even if they resist standard justification patterns.

    Duncan Pritchard's interpretation emphasizes hinges as commitment-constituting rather than knowledge-constituting, arguing they represent a distinct epistemic category that enables rather than constitutes knowledge (Pritchard 2016). This view supports the parallel with Gödel's axioms: both hinges and mathematical axioms function as enabling commitments that make systematic inquiry possible without themselves being objects of that inquiry. The mathematical case strengthens Pritchard's insight by showing how even formal domains require such commitment-constituting foundations.

    This analysis extends beyond epistemology to reveal a striking parallel with Gödel's incompleteness theorems, which demonstrate analogous limits within formal mathematical systems. Just as Gödel showed that mathematical systems rely on axioms that cannot be proven within those systems, Wittgenstein's hinges reveal that epistemic systems rest on certainties that cannot be justified internally. This comparison suggests a fundamental structural limitation in rational grounding, whether in mathematics or human knowledge, and invites reconsideration of what it means for knowledge to be properly grounded.

    Section 2: Gödel’s Unprovable Statements as Mathematical Hinges

    Gödel's incompleteness theorems, published in 1931, establish fundamental limits within formal systems, revolutionizing our understanding of mathematical foundations. Gödel demonstrated that within any consistent system of arithmetic, there will always be statements that are true under the standard interpretation but cannot be proven within the system itself. For instance, the statement asserting the system's own consistency, a meaningful mathematical claim about the system's properties, cannot be demonstrated within that system, even if the system is indeed consistent. Moreover, no such system can demonstrate its own consistency. Such statements are meaningful propositions with definite truth values that reveal structural limitations inherent to formal systems. This limitation persists even when systems are extended. Adding new axioms to prove previously unprovable truths creates strengthened systems that, if consistent and sufficiently powerful, generate their own sets of true but unprovable statements. The cycle of incompleteness is thus perpetual, revealing not a flaw in particular systems but a structural feature of formal mathematics itself.

    This limitation mirrors Wittgenstein's hinges in important ways. Just as hinges are certainties that cannot be justified within the epistemic systems they support, Gödel's results show that mathematical systems require axiomatic starting points that cannot be proven within those systems. The Peano axioms, which establish the foundation for arithmetic, exemplify this necessity. These axioms are not accepted because they are provable; they cannot be proven within the systems they generate. Rather, they are adopted as systematic starting points that enable mathematical development, chosen because they make possible coherent, productive systems.

    The parallel extends to the necessity of external acceptance. Gödel's systems require axioms accepted from outside the formal system itself, while Wittgenstein's hinges are certainties not arrived at through investigation but accepted as part of our form of life (OC 138). In both cases, what enables the system lies beyond the system's internal capacity for justification. Mathematical axioms and epistemic hinges both function as ungrounded grounds, foundational elements that make systematic inquiry possible precisely because they are not themselves subject to the forms of scrutiny they enable.

    Yet there is an important difference here: mathematical axioms are typically chosen for their elegance, consistency, and power to generate interesting mathematics, while hinges appear more embedded in contingent cultural and biological practices. Yet this difference strengthens rather than weakens the parallel. If even mathematics, often considered the paradigm of rigorous proof, requires unjustified foundational elements, how much more must everyday understanding rely on unexamined certainties? The universality of this structural requirement across domains as different as formal mathematics and lived experience suggests a fundamental feature of how systems of thought must be organized.

    Both domains thus reveal that functioning without such foundational elements is implausible. Mathematical systems risk incoherence without axiomatic starting points, just as epistemic practices risk collapse without the bedrock certainties that Wittgenstein identifies. The parallel illuminates a shared structural necessity: systematic thought requires ungrounded foundations that enable rather than undermine the possibility of reasoning within those systems.

    Section 3: Beyond Internal Justification: A Cross-Domain Analysis

    Both Wittgenstein and Gödel reveal that justification operates within boundaries, where certain elements serve as foundations that cannot be further justified within their respective systems. Both thinkers expose a basic structural feature of systematic thought: the impossibility of a complete system of justification in either domain.

    Traditional approaches to knowledge often assume that proper justification requires tracing claims back to secure foundations that are themselves justified. This assumption generates the classical problem of infinite regress: any attempt to justify foundational elements through further reasoning creates an endless chain of justification that never reaches secure ground. Both Wittgenstein's hinges and Gödel's axioms reveal why this demand for complete internal justification is not merely difficult but impossible in principle.

    As Wittgenstein observes, "There is no why. I simply do not. This is how I act" (OC 148). This insight captures something crucial about the nature of foundational certainties: they are pre-rational in the sense that they precede and enable rational discourse rather than emerging from it. Hinges are not conclusions we reach through reasoning but lived realities that make reasoning possible. Similarly, mathematical axioms are not theorems we prove but starting points we adopt to make proof possible.

    There is an important difference between these domains. Hinges emerge from contingent practices embedded in particular forms of life, while mathematical axioms are selected through systematic considerations within formal contexts. Hinges reflect the biological and cultural circumstances of human existence, whereas axioms reflect choices made for their mathematical power and elegance. If anything, this difference makes the parallel more compelling by demonstrating its scope: if even the most rigorous formal disciplines require unjustified starting points, the necessity of such foundations in everyday knowledge becomes even more apparent.

    This cross-domain similarity reveals what appears to be a universal structural requirement. Systems of thought, whether formal mathematical theories or practical epistemic frameworks, cannot achieve complete self-justification. They require external elements that are not justified within the system but make systematic inquiry within that framework possible. Rather than representing failures or limitations, these unjustified foundations function as enabling conditions that make coherent thought and practice possible.

    Recognizing this structural necessity transforms how we understand the relationship between certainty and knowledge. Instead of viewing unjustified elements as epistemological problems to be solved, we can understand them as necessary features that allow knowledge systems to function. Both mathematical proof and everyday understanding depend on foundations that lie beyond their internal capacity for justification, yet this dependence enables rather than undermines their respective forms of systematic inquiry.

    Conclusion

    I have argued for a fundamental parallel between Wittgenstein's hinges and Gödel's incompleteness results: both demonstrate that systematic thought requires ungrounded foundations. By examining how epistemic and mathematical systems share this structural feature, we gain insight into the nature of foundational certainties across domains of human understanding.

    The parallel between these seemingly distinct philosophical insights suggests that the limits of internal justification are not accidental features of particular systems but necessary conditions for systematic thought. Recognizing this gives us a more realistic picture of how knowledge actually functions, not through endless chains of justification reaching some ultimate ground, but through practices and formal systems that rest on foundations lying beyond their internal scope.

    Rather than viewing these limits as philosophical problems requiring solutions, this analysis suggests embracing them as structural necessities that make knowledge possible. Wittgenstein's hinges ground our epistemic practices in the lived realities of human existence, while Gödel's axioms ground mathematical systems in choices that prove their worth through the coherent theories they generate. Both reveal that the search for completely self-grounding systems is not merely difficult but misconceived.

    I believe this perspective has broader implications for understanding certainty and knowledge. It suggests that the interplay between grounded and ungrounded elements is not a flaw in human reasoning but a fundamental feature of how systematic understanding must be structured. By recognizing this necessity, we can develop more nuanced approaches to foundational questions in epistemology, philosophy of mathematics, and potentially other domains where the relationship between systematic inquiry and its enabling conditions remains philosophically significant.




    References

    Gödel, K. (1931). Über formal unentscheidbare Sätze der Principia Mathematica und verwandter Systeme I. Monatshefte für Mathematik und Physik, 38, 173-198.

    Moyal-Sharrock, D. (2004). Understanding Wittgenstein's On Certainty. Palgrave Macmillan.

    Pritchard, D. (2016). Epistemic Angst: Radical Skepticism and the Groundlessness of Our Believing. Princeton University Press.

    Wittgenstein, L. (1969). On Certainty (G. E. M. Anscombe & G. H. von Wright, Eds.; D. Paul & G. E. M. Anscombe, Trans.). Basil Blackwell.
  • Joshs
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    Thank you for this well-presented OP. While I agree that Godel’s incompleteness theorems can lend themselves to the assumption of groundless grounds akin to Wittgenstein ‘hinges’, I don’t believe Godel would have been comfortable with such a relativistic, pragmatist conclusion. He considered himself a mathematical platonist. As Roger Penrose says about Godel:

    Godel, himself, was a very strong Platonist…
    The notion of mathematical truth goes beyond the whole concept of formalism. There is something absolute and "God-given' about mathematical truth. This is what mathematical Platonism, as discussed at the end of the last chapter, is about. Any particular formal system has a provisional and 'man-made' quality about it. Such systems indeed have very valuable roles to play in mathematical discussions, but they can supply only a partial (or approximate) guide to truth. Real mathematical truth goes beyond mere manmade constructions. (The Emperor’s New Mind)
  • Amity
    5.8k
    Thank you for this well-presented OP.Joshs

    To clarify, this is not an OP. It is part of the Philosophy Writing Challenge - June 2025.
    https://thephilosophyforum.com/categories/55/phil-writing-challenge-june-2025

    It is an essay whose author will be identified later. To keep anonymity, Moliere has posted all 13 entries in his name.
  • ssu
    9.4k
    A crucial distinction emerges between subjective and objective dimensions of these certainties. While our relationship to hinges involves unquestioning acceptance, this certainty is not merely psychological. These assumptions are shaped by our interactions with a world that both constrains and enables our practices. The certainty reflected in our actions has an objective component, as it emerges from our shared engagement with reality and proves itself through the successful functioning of our practices.Moliere
    Everything is about objectivity and subjectivity, actually. It's not merely a psychological issue, but simply logical. We can easily understand subjectivity as someone's (or some things) point of view and objectivity as "a view without a viewpoint". To put this into a logical and mathematical context makes it a bit different. Here both Gödel and Wittgenstein are extremely useful.

    In logic and math a true statement that is objective can be computed and ought to be provable. Yet when it's subjective, this isn't so: something subjective refers to itself.

    Do note the self-referential aspect Gödel's incompleteness theorems, even if Gödel smartly avoids direct circular reference of Russell's Paradox. Yet I would argue that Wittgenstein observes this even in the Tractatus Logicus Philosophicus as he thinks about Russell's paradox:

    3.332 3.332 No proposition can say anything about itself, because the propositional sign cannot be contained in itself (that is the “whole theory of types”).

    3.333 A function cannot be its own argument, because the functional sign already contains the prototype of its own argument and it cannot contain itself. If, for example, we suppose that the function F(fx) could be its own argument, then there would be a proposition “F(F(fx))”, and in this the outer function F and the inner function F must have different meanings; for the inner has the form ϕ(fx), the outer the form ψ(ϕ(fx)). Common to both functions is only the letter “F”, which by itself signifies nothing.This is at once clear, if instead of “F(F(u))” we write “There exists g : F(gu). gu = Fu”.

    Herewith Russell’s paradox vanishes.

    Here I think it's very important to understand just what is objective and what is subjective in this context. An objective model can is true when it models reality correctly and can be written as a function like y = F(x). But what then would be a subjective model, that couldn't be put into the above objective mold?

    Let's take one example. Let's assume that the market pricing mechanism is dependent on the aggregate actions of all market participants. This obviously is true: trade at some price happens only when there is at least one participant willing to sell at the price and at least one willing to buy with the similar price. At first this looks quite objective and we can write as a mathematical function like y = F(X). But then, if we want to use this model, let's say to forecast what prices are going to be in the future and then participate in the market, this isn't anymore an objective function. Now actually the function is defining itself, which as Wittgenstein observed, cannot contain itself. Us using the function is self-referential, because the model is the aggregate of all market participants actions, including us. How are we deciding our actions? Because of the function itself.

    I have argued for a fundamental parallel between Wittgenstein's hinges and Gödel's incompleteness results: both demonstrate that systematic thought requires ungrounded foundations. By examining how epistemic and mathematical systems share this structural feature, we gain insight into the nature of foundational certainties across domains of human understanding.Moliere
    If I understand correctly what you mean by grounded / ungrounded foundations, I would say it differently: Not all systematic thought can be brought back to grounded foundations. Usually we can use axiomatic systems and get an objective model, but not allways.

    Just as there is also Gödel's completeness theorem, that theorem doesn't collide with the two incompleteness theorems.
  • Wayfarer
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    The parallel between these seemingly distinct philosophical insights suggests that the limits of internal justification are not accidental features of particular systems but necessary conditions for systematic thought.Moliere

    Splendid composition.

    Isn't this rather a long-winded way of saying that there are indeed necessary truths? That necessary truths can't be, and don't need to be, justified in other terms - that's what makes them necessary. As Thomas Nagel remarks on an essay on the sovereignty of reason, 'the epistemic buck must stop somewhere'; there are thoughts we can't 'get outside of', or judge according to some other criterion, without thereby undermining their necessity ('contingent cultural and biological practices').

    I think what's interesting about this whole line of thought is why it's interesting. Why is it we presume that foundational ('hinge') propositions can be or need to be justified by further analysis, and what are the implications of their not being so justified?
  • Count Timothy von Icarus
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    Very nicely done. It's an interesting topic!

    While our relationship to hinges involves unquestioning acceptance,

    This would make hinges quite a bit different from many axioms. But must hinges involve unquestioning acceptance? Isn't that the whole history of skepticism, questioning such foundations? And for most of the ancient skeptics at least, this questioning wasn't an epistemic exercise, so much as a practical one. One questioned one's bedrock beliefs so as to attain equipollence, a sort of detached equilibrium between beliefs such that one was not concerned about anything and could attain apatheia.

    Anyhow, I figured this might have relevance for reason as such (as opposed to any one system), since, as Hegel says, to have ever recognized a limit is to have already stepped over it. The fish doesn't know where the water ends; it's only the frog, who has actually broken the surface, who sees it as a limit. The sorts of hinges we accept unquestioningly would seem to have to be ones we could never even be aware of. It would have to be something more akin to the blindspot in the visual field (although even that example fails, since one can become aware of that with careful experiment).



    Why is it we presume that foundational ('hinge') propositions can be or need to be justified by further analysis, and what are the implications of their not being so justified?

    Indeed. And it's perhaps somewhat of a historical question because plenty of thinkers prior to the heyday of foundationalist aspirations take it as somewhat obvious (to them) that some truths (and really the more important, "foundational" ones) cannot even be expressed in human language, let alone subjected to something like a mathematical proof. For example, Saint John of Damascus says this in matter of fact terms at the outset of the Exact Exposition, Plato inveighs against the inadequacy of words and justificatory dissertations in his seventh letter, and then there is Saint Paul's famous mention of being "caught up to the third heaven" and hearing "inexpressible words, which a human being is not allowed to speak."

    I would guess the Cartesian dream of a world reducible to mathematics is a major impetus here. Timothy Shutt has an interesting lecture where he suggests that the decline in epics is in part due to the fact that they lost their place as authoritative sources to mathematics (and this is a problem Milton is grappling with as he tries to write a new Protestant epic in an environment where epic and scripture is losing this authority).
  • Joshs
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    Isn't this rather a long-winded way of saying that there are indeed necessary truths? That necessary truths can't be, and don't need to be, justified in other terms - that's what makes them necessary. As Thomas Nagel remarks on an essay on the sovereignty of reason, 'the epistemic buck must stop somewhere'; there are thoughts we can't 'get outside of', or judge according to some other criterion, without thereby undermining their necessity ('contingent cultural and biological practices').

    I think what's interesting about this whole line of thought is why it's interesting. Why is it we presume that foundational ('hinge') propositions can be or need to be justified by further analysis, and what are the implications of their not being so justified?
    Wayfarer

    The problem I have with the essay is that it fails to distinguish between a notion of necessary truth as a relative, contingently stable structure of meaning (Wittgenstein’s hinges, forms of life and language games) and a notion of necessary truth as a platonic transcendental, which is how Godel views the necessary ground of mathematical axioms.
  • hypericin
    1.7k
    The problem I have with the essay is that it fails to distinguish between a notion of necessary truth as a relative, contingently stable structure of meaning (Wittgenstein’s hinges, forms of life and language games) and a notion of necessary truth as a platonic transcendental, which is how Godel views the necessary ground of mathematical axioms.Joshs

    I think I had a similar thought. But the essay works in spite of that distinction. Functionally, there is a parallel. On both sides, you have the objects of discourse, and you have the unquestioned background. Both linguistic and mathematical discourses need both. And, what counts as object and background is relative in both cases: relative to the language game, and relative to the mathematical domain.
  • Wayfarer
    24.6k
    The problem I have with the essay is that it fails to distinguish between a notion of necessary truth as a relative, contingently stable structure of meaning (Wittgenstein’s hinges, forms of life and language games) and a notion of necessary truth as a platonic transcendental, which is how Godel views the necessary ground of mathematical axioms.Joshs

    I see your point. So could you say that Wittgenstein's hinges can in some sense be situated, or understood in terms of lived existence and 'language games' whereas Godel's platonic transcendentals simply are, without any reference to context or situatedness?
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  • Wayfarer
    24.6k
    Example of such a "necessary truth," pleasetim wood

    That if I have six beers in the fridge, and you come and drink one, there will be five remaining, everything else being equal. But to provide more context for Thomas Nagel's expression, in particular, the paragraph from which it is taken was:

    The only form that genuine reasoning can take consists in seeing the validity of the arguments, in virtue of what they say. As soon as one tries to step outside of such thoughts, one loses contact with their true content. And one cannot be outside and inside them at the same time: If one thinks in logic, one cannot simultaneously regard those thoughts as mere psychological dispositions, however caused or however biologically grounded. If one decides that some of one's psychological dispositions are, as a contingent matter of fact, reliable methods of reaching the truth (as one may with perception, for example), then in doing so one must rely on other thoughts that one actually thinks, without regarding them as mere dispositions. One cannot embed all one's reasoning in a psychological theory, including the reasonings that have led to that psychological theory. The epistemological buck must stop somewhere. By this I mean not that there must be some premises that are forever unrevisable but, rather, that in any process of reasoning or argument there must be some thoughts that one simply thinks from the inside--rather than thinking of them as biologically programmed dispositions. — Thomas Nagel, The Last Word (New York: Oxford University Press, 1997), p 137

    So he's saying that the attempt to rationalise what I think are being described as 'hinge propositions' is to view them from the outside - to evaluate them in some other terms, such as biologically-programmed dispositions. (We see a lot of that here.)
  • RussellA
    2.2k
    "This paper argues that ungrounded certainties enable knowledge, rather than undermining it, and that hinges and Gödel's unprovable statements serve a similar purpose."

    If only all philosophy writing was as clearly written as this essay.

    How do axioms and hinges relate to knowledge?

    Let the axiom be "the sun rises in the east". This axiom can never be proved true. If one day the sun rose in the west, then the axiom is false. The axiom "the sun rises in the east" is not knowledge, as it can never be proved true.

    Let the hinge be "the sun rises in the east". This hinge is a certainty. If one day what we think is the sun rises in the west, then what we see cannot be the sun. The hinge "the sun rises in the east" is knowledge regardless of what we observe.

    Whereas hinges enable knowledge, axioms don't serve a similar purpose, as they can never be knowledge
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  • Count Timothy von Icarus
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    This paper argues that ungrounded certainties enable knowledge, rather than undermining it, and that hinges and Gödel's unprovable statements serve a similar purpose."

    If only all philosophy writing was as clearly written as this essay

    I did very much like the paper, but this statement of the thesis (which occurs a few times) actually strikes me as somewhat ambiguous.

    The point could be either:

    A. That actually, fully self-justifying, air tight foundational systems would be somehow deficient (e.g. if logicism re mathematics could be decisively demonstrated it would somehow actually undermine knowledge); or

    B. Because a fully self-justifying system is impossible, ungrounded certainties are essential for knowledge.

    I assume from the paper that B is meant though, since it does not give any indication of why A should be the case.

    The problem I see, which @Joshs gets at, is that B seems to risk equivocating re many common and classical definitions of "knowledge." A critic could say that knowledge is about the possession of truth simpliciter. It is not about possession or assent to "what is true given some foundational/hinge belief" (which itself may be true or untrue). This redefinition seems to open the door on "knowing" things that are false.

    Hence, I think someone holding to a classical notion of knowledge as the possession of truth, and truth as "the adequacy of the intellect to being," might be inclined to say that the solution here is actually radically skeptical. All that is "known" is based on that which is not known. "Knowledge" ceases to be knowledge. Further, all demonstration from first principles would flow, ultimately, from premises that could be said to be less well known than their conclusions (making them bunk demonstrations from the Aristotleian point of view).

    This would arguably be one of Kripke's "skeptical solutions" (as opposed to a straight solution), redefining "knowledge" in a fairly radical way (although perhaps not as radical as some moves, e.g. Quine).


    An unrelated comment on that thesis statement: might the axiom not be more analogous to the hinge propositions than the unprovable statement? No doubt, the unprovable statement (as the existence of uncomputable or inexpressible statements) seems relevant, but I'm not sure if it fills the same role.

    But this shifts focus on to why axioms are chosen. Certainly, it is sometimes "because they produce interesting results," particularly as mathematicians tinker with existing, established systems. Yet in general, they are selected because they are considered true, and indeed they are ideally indubitable. However, this is not "true given some prior axioms," but, hopefully, "true absolutely." For instance, Euclid's postulates held up so well because it seemed fair to dismiss someone who denied them as insane or acting in bad faith. "Take out paper, a pencil, ruler, and protractor and see for yourself." An ideal axiom hits that level, although obviously they do not always.
  • ucarr
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    Wittgenstein's hinges bear a remarkable resemblance to Gödel's incompleteness theorems, revealing unprovable mathematical statements. This resemblance points to deeper questions about how both domains handle foundational issues. Both Wittgenstein and Gödel uncover limits to internal justification, a connection I will examine.Moliere

    Does anyone suspect, as I do, that the linkage connecting Wittgenstein's hinges to Gödel's incompleteness theorems suggests some type of symmetry (and conservation of the possible scope of narrative elaboration (whether verbal or numerical) i.e., conservation of containable fundamentals within a system ) extending from verbal language to both numerical language and chains of reasoning?
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  • Wayfarer
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    The issue for me is the claim that there are so-called absolute truths, that there are propositions that are true without reference to some, or any, criteria or standard that gives the proposition its truth. And it's turtles.... That is, in any final analysis, what is true is what we decide is true.tim wood

    That's close to the Protagorean view — that truth is always relative to the perceiver or to the community's standards of justification ('man is the measure of all things"). There are only truths for us. But this view has profound implications, not least of which is that it undermines the possibility of truth as something we discover rather than merely decide. But If all truth is decided rather than discovered, then the proposition “truth is what we decide” must also be just a decision, not a truth, and one that we're under no rational obligation to accept. And if it’s presented as a universal fact, that stands in contradiction to relativism, as we're obliged to accept it.

    Furthermore the whimsical example of the six-pack of beer made no reference to the absolute, but only to necessary facts - that given six of something, the subtraction of one will invariably leave five. I can't see how that can be a matter of controversy.

    in the accretion of truths some are buried so deeply they are no longer candidates for debate or even consciously made; they're simply presupposed, becoming buried foundations for thinking. Which is a difference from axioms because axioms usually made explicit.tim wood

    And this cuts against your earlier claim - If some truths are so deeply embedded that they’re not decided but rather constitutive of meaning, then they’re not “true because we say so.” They’re true as conditions of intelligibility - already a step away from relativism (and near in meaning to the 'hinge propositions' we're discussing.)

    Modern discourse often shies away from talk of ‘absolute truth’ — it’s seen as naïve, dogmatic, or even authoritarian. But that taboo has become a dogma in its own right! It is true that articulating any notion of the absolute is difficult — perhaps even impossible in a fully transparent or complete way — but it is part of what philosophy is about.

    By contrast, the idea that truth is what we decide it is, sounds superficially tolerant but collapses into incoherence if pushed. If we genuinely believe that all truths are relative to individual or social standards, we lose traction in anything beyond personal preference. Disagreement becomes either a clash of taste or a power struggle, not a pursuit of understanding.

    So I think we have to ask ourselves — not just in epistemology but across our culture — what’s lost when we treat truth as if it were merely a social construct. At the very least, philosophy ought to keep open the question of whether some truths are not of our own making, even if they are hard to articulate.

    That is very much the thrust of Thomas Nagel’s The Last Word, where he defends the idea that reason has a kind of intrinsic authority that transcends subjective or cultural standpoints. He takes aim at the creeping relativism in contemporary thought that treats logic, objectivity, and justification as mere social conventions or evolutionary adaptations or instruments of power. Nagel argues that this position ends up undermining itself, because the relativist must rely on the very norms of truth and logic that they’re trying to dismiss. His point isn’t that everything is absolutely true in some metaphysical sense, but that there are certain truths — logical, mathematical, even ethical — which are binding not because we agree on them, but because they compel assent through reason itself. Facts that reason compels us to accept.
  • Leontiskos
    4.5k
    Wittgenstein's Hinges and Gödel's Unprovable StatementsMoliere

    This is a very relevant topic on TPF, so I think the submission is appropriate.

    If one’s notion of epistemic justification is dependent on other epistemically justified beliefs, then the infinite regress looms. Or as I've said , it "is a bit like a novice bricklayer’s idea that every brick needs to rest on two other bricks. But this leads to an infinite regress, for there must be a foundation which itself supports the lowest bricks."

    The basic way to avoid this infinite regress is by positing more than one kind of justification. For example, the justification that attaches to foundational beliefs versus the justification that attaches to non-foundational beliefs, where the justification that attaches to foundational beliefs is not dependent on other epistemically justified beliefs.

    Wittgenstein’s solution is apparently to make a distinction between different kinds of beliefs (or “propositions”) but to dismiss the idea that foundational beliefs require justification. So there are different kinds of beliefs but not different kinds of justification.

    In other words, given the following argument, Wittgenstein would apparently accept 1, 2, and 3, but reject 4 and 5.

    1. Either every belief is justified in virtue of other beliefs, or else some beliefs are not justified in virtue of other beliefs.
    2. If every belief is justified in virtue of other beliefs, then an infinite regress results.
    3. Therefore, some beliefs are not justified in virtue of other beliefs.
    4. Every belief requires justification.
    5. Therefore, even beliefs that are not justified in virtue of other beliefs still require justification.

    The rejection of 4 is a significant problem for Wittgenstein, but there is another problem. The justification/warrant of an argument's conclusion flows from the justification/warrant of the argument's premises, in much the same way that electricity travels from one end of a conductive surface to another. Yet Wittgenstein believes that he can begin with premises which possess no justification/warrant, and from them infer conclusions that possess justification/warrant. This is not coherent, and the same issue rears its head in reverse when we consider the fact that a modus tollens critique moves from conclusion to premises (or more precisely, from consequent to antecedent). It is irrational to try to divorce premises from conclusion qua justification.

    As Wittgenstein observes, "There is no why. I simply do not. This is how I act" (OC 148).Moliere

    How should we respond to Wittgenstein here? Apparently by pointing out to him that there is a why, and that other people act differently than he does. As soon as two people who act in foundationally different ways come into contact with one another the "why" will become a question of interest.

    But what about Gödel?

    Just as Gödel showed that mathematical systems rely on axioms that cannot be proven within those systems, Wittgenstein's hinges reveal that epistemic systems rest on certainties that cannot be justified internally.Moliere

    This is simply a misunderstanding of Gödel. Mathematicians since Euclid knew that axioms could not be proved. This is nothing new. Gödel's contribution has to do with the completeness of formal systems, not the self-justification of formal systems. In fact most thinkers already believed that formal systems lacked completeness, but Gödel proved it and in the process destroyed the hopes of Wittgenstein's friends in the Vienna Circle.

    I don't suspect that Gödel shared Wittgenstein's confusion in this matter, but perhaps someone who is familiar with Gödel's wider work could comment. I don't suspect that Gödel confused formal reasoning with natural reasoning. Formal logic has a very strong dichotomy between axioms and consequences, to the extent that there is a schizophrenic gulf between the two with regard to justification. Natural reasoning does not work that way.

    (Note that Wittgenstein tends to shift haphazardly back and forth between psychological description and logical normativity, and this complicates but does not invalidate the picture I have drawn. Gödel does not do this. He is not arguing for the idea of unjustifiable premises.)
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  • Wayfarer
    24.6k
    By true I mean a property, call it T of P, such that for proposition P, P is T, if in fact it is. Sometimes I might refer to it as the "truth" of P, by which I mean just another way to say that P is T. And if there is a bunch of different Ps, all with the property T, I might use "truth" to refer collectively to those Ts. And this exercise to clarify between us whether or not you attach any further meaning to "truth." As in, there is such a thing as truth. I hold there is not. I hold there is no such thing as truth, and the word is properly understood as an abstract general collective noun referring only to the property T which is only a property of individual Ps. If you disagree, please define "truth."tim wood

    Redefining it in semantic terms is a deflationary or minimalist move. This aligns with the disquotational theory of truth (e.g. “’Snow is white’ is true if and only if snow is white”), which claims that truth is not a substantive property, but merely a linguistic device for generalizing over propositions.

    However, this doesn’t rebut the charge of relativism — it obscures it. If you say that no proposition is true in itself but only because we say it is T, then we’re right back to Protagoras:

    "What is true is what we decide is true."

    The sleight of hand here is that he avoids making a metaphysical claim about truth by shifting into a formal, semantic register — but this move itself carries a metaphysical implication, namely that truth has no independent reality beyond the operation of language and consensus.

    You ask for a definition of "truth" as though it's a settled term — but even among philosophers, it remains contested. Some adopt deflationary or minimalist theories (like yours), others argue for correspondence, coherence, or pragmatic theories, and still others defend truth as a transcendental condition for meaning or knowledge. The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy lists over a dozen major theories. So we can't assume it's a straightforward term reducible to a single semantic function.

    If we reduce 'truth' to nothing but the property T of a proposition P — and then define T solely in terms of human stipulation — then we haven't solved anything; we've just defined truth out of existence, and replaced it with consensus or coherence within some human framework. But that doesn’t answer the philosophical question. It dodges it.
  • Leontiskos
    4.5k
    By true I mean a property, call it T of P, such that for proposition P, P is T, if in fact it is.tim wood

    What does "it is" mean? Does it mean "it is T"? Or "it is true"? Either way your definition is circular:

    • Former: "By true I mean a property, call it T of P, such that for proposition P, P is T, if in fact it is T."
    • Latter: "By true I mean a property, call it T of P, such that for proposition P, P is T, if in fact it is true."

    This is an indication that defining truth is more difficult than one might first expect. Truth is something which is characteristically resistant to univocal sequestering within the object language or meta language (which is why philosophers like Buridan explicitly rejected the notion that the two "languages" are separable).
  • RussellA
    2.2k
    I did very much like the paper, but this statement of the thesis (which occurs a few times) actually strikes me as somewhat ambiguous.Count Timothy von Icarus

    I also liked the paper, and liked that it was clearly written. As Prof. Adrian Piper wrote in his article "Ten Commandments of Philosophical Writing" Thou shalt not obscure thy ideas with turgid prose.

    Being clearly written then allows me to understand what the author is trying to say, even if I disagree with the author's premise that "ungrounded certainties enable knowledge", and even if I find parts of the author's essay ambiguous.

    The author is standing their ground in being clear in what they are saying. This enables the reader to properly engage with their argument, even if the reader then disagrees with the author's argument. It is then up to the reader to explain why they disagree with the author's argument, thereby moving the philosophical debate forwards. Philosophy should be a dialogue, as Adrian Piper says in his article "Ten Commandments of Philosophical Writing".

    A clearly written philosophical essay is the hinge upon which new philosophical knowledge may be gained.
    ===============================================================================
    The problem I see, which Joshs gets at, is that B seems to risk equivocating re many common and classical definitions of "knowledge." A critic could say that knowledge is about the possession of truth simpliciter. It is not about possession or assent to "what is true given some foundational/hinge belief" (which itself may be true or untrue). This redefinition seems to open the door on "knowing" things that are false.Count Timothy von Icarus

    As you say, to say that hinges give knowledge is not generally how we understand the word knowledge, as being something that is universally true.

    For the animalist, all things, including animals, plants and rocks, possess a distinct spiritual essence. For the animalist, their hinge proposition may be "this plant possesses a spiritual essence". This gives them the knowledge that this plant possesses a spiritual essence.

    For the atheist, no thing possesses a distinct spiritual essence. For the atheist, their hinge proposition may be "this plant doesn't possesses a spiritual essence". This gives them the knowledge that this plant doesn't possesses a spiritual essence.

    The animalist sees a plant and knowing that all plants possess a spiritual essence knows that the plant they are looking at possesses a spiritual essence. The atheist sees the same plant and knowing that no things possess a spiritual essence knows that the plant that they are looking at doesn't possess a spiritual essence.

    As you say, this is not how we understand knowledge, being something universally true.

    The hinge proposition imposes itself on the world. We then observe this world. This enables us to confirm that the hinge proposition is true. The hinge proposition confirms its own truth self-referentially.

    Another example. Let my hinge proposition be "the sun always rises in the east". In the event that I observe the sun rising in the east, this confirms my hinge proposition. In the event that I observe what I think is the sun rising in the west, then it cannot be the sun, thereby again confirming my hinge proposition.

    A hinge proposition such as "here is one hand" gives knowledge that here is one hand. But this is self-referential knowledge, which is not how we generally understand knowledge as being universally true, as you say.
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  • Leontiskos
    4.5k
    And it's odd - peculiar - how difficult it is.tim wood

    I would say that it has something to do with the idea that truth is the water we swim in, and it is hard to identify that sort of thing. Probably only in the presence of two apparent and conflicting truths does the notion of 'truth' emerge more clearly.

    At a much more general level, I would be very wary to discount a word/concept that is so ubiquitous throughout human civilization. Those sorts of words/concepts tend to have a meaning, even if the meaning is difficult to pin down.
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  • Leontiskos
    4.5k
    Btw, truth I dismiss. True I do not dismiss.tim wood

    I distinguish between the adjective, "true," and the noun, "truth," the one an accident, a quality, the other a substance, or should be.tim wood

    Suppose you said, "There are true [somethings], but there are no truths." I would just respond, "What are these [somethings] that are true?" The ontological problem attaches to propositions as much as it attaches to truths, or to whatever [something] the "adjective" modifies.
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  • Wayfarer
    24.6k
    There is no metaphysical claim to be made. Truth (in- and by-itself) does not exist.tim wood

    Doesn't the second claim contradict the first? How is the statement 'truth (in- and by-itself) does not exist' not a metaphysical claim?

    Now separate the true from the proposition as something separate from and not a part of the proposition. You cannot do it. And that which you might try to separate is usually called truth. So what is it? What is truth - beyond being just a general idea? All day long people may argue that truth is a something. They don't have to argue, all they have to do is demonstrate it - show it. But that never has and never will happen.tim wood

    I see the logic of your position — you're treating truth as nothing over and above the attribution of a property to a proposition, and I understand the deflationary intuition behind that. But the issue at stake, especially given the original context (Wittgenstein and Gödel), isn’t just about semantics. I'm saying, that the issue is really about whether there is a domain of what we might call the unconditionally true — truths not simply constructed or declared within discourse, but which ground discourse itself. That’s a metaphysical and ontological question, not simply a linguistic one.

    Gödel, for example, was a mathematical Platonist. He believed that mathematical truths exist independently of our capacity to prove them — that they are so, whether we grasp them or not. Wittgenstein’s hinges aren’t proven either, but they’re not arbitrary. They are ‘taken to be true’ not because we say so, but because they constitute the background against which the very act of saying something becomes intelligible.

    To deny that there is such a thing as truth ‘beyond being just a general idea’ risks collapsing this structural distinction. If truth is only ever the local property of propositions as we use them, then you effectively deny the possibility of truths that are not contingent on our grasp or declaration. But isn’t that exactly what Gödel’s theorems reveal? That some truths outstrip the systems we build?

    This is just the kind of question Plato’s dialogues return to again and again — what it means for something to be true or to be good in itself. The dialogues often end in aporia, yes — but not as dismissals. Rather, they preserve the seriousness of the inquiry by refusing to reduce these questions to mere convention or definition or to provide a dogmatic solution. And we can’t define truth in some final way, that may be a sign of its depth, not its non-existence. Likewise, Socrates' consistent refusal to declare that he knows any kind of final truth - he's not denying that there is, but inviting deep contemplation of the question. (Is this why Socrates was said to have sometimes fallen into a kind of trance, standing rooted to the spot for hours or days? That stillness might itself be a kind of answer: a living witness to the fact that some truths are not merely stated, but must be grappled with through a deep questioning.)

    To consider whether anything is unconditionally true — not merely 'true for us' — we have to ask questions beyond usage and attribution. We’re talking about the architecture of thought and language, of being itself. Those aren’t things you can ‘show’ in an empirical way — but neither are they merely artifacts of language. They belong to the domain of what Kant might call the (transcendental) conditions for the possibility of experience and understanding. And that’s a philosophical question, not a semantic one.

    So there’s a deeper question here about the nature of truth — and it’s one that can’t be settled by appeal to semantics or usage alone. Certainly, truth doesn't exist as some abstract 'thing' out there in the world, waiting to be pointed to or depicted. But that doesn’t mean it’s not real.

    Classical philosophy speaks of 'intelligible objects' — principles or forms that do not exist qua phenomena, but which nonetheless structure intelligibility (ref). Think, for instance, of the law of the excluded middle. Does it 'exist'? Not in the empirical sense. But is it real? It seems inescapably so — not because we invented it, but because rational discourse depends on it.

    So in that sense, the truths of reason — logical principles, mathematical axioms, moral intelligibilities — don’t so much describe what exists as disclose the structure of intelligibility itself. They are not things among things, but conditions for thought, and for discourse.

    This is why the denial of truth as a real — though not empirical — dimension is so radical. It’s not just a semantic revision. It amounts to a dismantling of the very architecture of meaning. And that’s why thinkers from Plato to Augustine (and indeed, Gödel and Wittgenstein in their own ways) were so attentive to this domain of the intelligible — not as 'objects' in the modern sense, but as realities grasped by the intellect.
  • Leontiskos
    4.5k
    If you want an example of a true proposition, that's not too hard. That is to say, the proposition is true. Now separate the true from the proposition as something separate from and not a part of the proposition. You cannot do it. And that which you might try to separate is usually called truth. So what is it? What is truth - beyond being just a general idea? All day long people may argue that truth is a something. They don't have to argue, all they have to do is demonstrate it - show it. But that never has and never will happen.tim wood

    If we continue in your Analytic route we would simply say that a truth is a true proposition. Truth itself, apart from individual truths, could just be a general idea, sure. None of this seems problematic. We regularly appeal to general ideas, such as justice, mathematics, politics, sports, etc.
  • Count Timothy von Icarus
    3.8k


    It's not that hard to give a definition. Truth is the adequacy of thought to being. Being a transcendental, "true" is "said many ways," as it is predicated analogously. For instance, we can think of an utterance in terms of it being a sign of truth in the intellect of the speaker (true versus false knowledge claims) or in terms of the utterance accurately reflecting the beliefs of a speaker ("telling the truth" versus lying).

    In terms of logical truth:

    To judge that things are what they are is to judge truly. Every judgment comprises certain ideas which are referred to, or denied of, reality. But it is not these ideas that are the objects of our judgment. They are merely the instruments by means of which we judge. The object about which we judge is reality itself — either concrete existing things, their attributes, and their relations, or else entities the existence of which is merely conceptual or imaginary, as in drama, poetry, or fiction, but in any case entities which are real in the sense that their being is other than our present thought about them. Reality, therefore, is one thing, and the ideas and judgments by means of which we think about reality, another; the one objective, and the other subjective. Yet, diverse as they are, reality is somehow present to, if not present in consciousness when we think, and somehow by means of thought the nature of reality is revealed. This being the case, the only term adequate to describe the relation that exists between thought and reality, when our judgments about the latter are true judgments, would seem to be conformity or correspondence. "Veritas logica est adaequatio intellectus et rei" (Summa, I:21:2). Whenever truth is predicable of a judgment, that judgment corresponds to, or resembles, the reality, the nature or attributes of which it reveals. Every judgment is, however, as we have said, made up of ideas, and may be logically analyzed into a subject and a predicate, which are either united by the copula is, or disjoined by the expression is not. If the judgment be true, therefore, these ideas must also be true, i.e. must correspond with the realities which they signify. As, however, this objective reference or significance of ideas is not recognized or asserted except in the judgment, ideas as such are said to be only "materially" true. It is the judgment alone that is formally true, since in the judgment alone is a reference to reality formally made, and truth as such recognized or claimed.

    https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15073a.htm

    See also: https://www.newadvent.org/summa/1016.htm
    https://isidore.co/aquinas/QDdeVer1.htm
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