I guess I'm just getting old my friend. The torrential bullshit storm has worn me out. — Hippyhead

I can see that -- and that's a shame, I think. But you're in big company, and that's exactly the problem. And you're well above average in your activism -- most are too busy keeping food on the table to have any time, and others are either too distracted, too apathetic, or completely disenfranchised to do anything.

These stories you tell are pretty defeatist, though, don't you think? It's very selective, skewed towards negative experiences. The very fact that you got a meeting on national television is an enormous success, for example -- yet you focus on a dickhead sheriff's poor reaction to you? I do sympathize, because those things really do suck and obviously can be demoralizing, but I don't see the alternative. By quitting, or laying down, you're essentially helping the opposite forces along.

This thread is a good example, yes. OK, so people aren't focused enough on nuclear weapons. Then it's your job to educate them. Who says you can't?

Yea, ok, I can hear that. Cowardly does seem accurate. So is there any point to another impeachment then in your opinion? — Hippyhead

Yeah, just in terms of precedent. It puts the Republicans in a position to have to vote against it, which is good, while keeping Trump's ability to run again in tact when it fails, which is (I would argue) ALSO good for this country. Why? Because if he runs again, it'll further divide the Republican party during the primaries, and after four years and the memory of this event, he'll likely lose -- assuming the Democrats don't completely blow it these next few years. But as soon as I wrote that last part, I'm beginning to think he may have a shot after all.

These stories you tell are pretty defeatist, though, don't you think? — Xtrix

Ok, fair enough. To a significant degree I've lost faith in humanity. I'm pretty cheerful about that most of the time, but when pressed to explain I have to air the dirt that caused me to lose faith. I don't hate anybody or anything like that, but am I still willing to invest tons of time in trying to save people from themselves? No, been there, done that. Your turn now.

t's very selective, skewed towards negative experiences. — Xtrix

I did have some great experiences which I don't regret. It's like what some veterans say about being in the service. Great experience, don't wanna do it again. :-)

This thread is a good example, yes. OK, so people aren't focused enough on nuclear weapons. Then it's your job to educate them. Who says you can't? — Xtrix

I say I can't. See this thread, total waste of time.

https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/9333/insanity-squared

Sorry, really truly not trying to be a dickhead, but honestly speaking...

Members here, and professional philosophers too, simply too dense to get nuclear weapons. And for quite awhile I was too dense to get that they are too dense to get it.

Now I get that the subject is simply too big for them, for me, for us, for reason. I'm not as negative as these posts suggest, but more philosophical, seeing the reality more clearly, making peace with it. Very interesting subject, but now I am ridiculously off topic so.... :-)

What is Trump doing with his new found free time? — Benkei

Yes, he is likely missing those 88 million followers that he had on Twitter. (I guess the 51 people he followed aren't so much missing him)

Without Twitter, he is missing something:


Trump is now going to Texas to see his much beloved wall. 400 miles of it. And visit the Alamo. I think after the forced on him talk, which he barely could make through reading from the teleprompter, Trump will get to be back himself tomorrow.

All he needs is to see his fanatic supporters, and off he goes...

assuming the Democrats don't completely blow it these next few years. But as soon as I wrote that last part, I'm beginning to think he may have a shot after all. — Xtrix

Yea, more wisdom from you. I think we under estimate Trump at our peril. Is he evil? Indisputably true. But is he also very street smart? True again.

If we can't bar him from running again then maybe other options will be required. And that's all you're gonna hear from here about that. :-)

Of course it’s a assumption, as are yours. That’s what happens when you try to predict the future.

But I don’t believe in conspiracy theories. I don’t think these people are smart enough to coordinate anything so grand. Rather, I believe they are unhinged, drunk on their own conspiracy theories, as they have been for the last 5 years. Just as they are silly enough to impeach a president for made up crimes, to propel a anti-Russian hoax around the world, to impeach him in the last days of his presidency, they are silly enough to criminalize his supporters. That’s not a stretch of the imagination.

Illinois Sen. Dick Durbin to reintroduce Domestic Terrorism Prevention Act

https://www.state.gov/biographies/donald-j-trump/

You may think it doesn't limit social interactions once they're already rolling; and for that I cite you the countless (I stopped counting earnestly after this happened with 15 separate people/social events) times someone has wanted to add me on Facebook, instead I offer them my email or phonenumber or Whatsapp, and the person immediately stops talking to me or never contacts me again using my suggested media. The intuition: what kind of weirdo exempts themselves from society like this? — fdrake

That has happened to me too and my takeaway was that this person isn’t actually interested in me personally so it’s no loss to not stay connected with them.

When I was a kid I never had a lot of friends because I didn’t understand how to make friends. As a young adult I intentionally figured out how and was then immensely popular and socially connected for about a decade. Until I realized how much effort I was spending being “connected” with people who didn’t really matter to me, to whom I didn’t really matter. So I just stopped putting in that effort, and none of them made an effort that stay in touch with me either, so my social life died... and nothing of value was lost.

The kind of people who will only “keep in touch” by adding you on facebook are precisely the kind of people it’s not worth the effort of keeping in touch with.

Very odd. But the time stamp keeps changing each time you refresh the page.

Same for Pence. Hopefully a disgruntled employee and not a hack, otherwise that's a concerning security issue.

Or Trump has been removed or will resign. I guess we’ll find out tonight.

The kind of people who will only “keep in touch” by adding you on facebook are precisely the kind of people it’s not worth the effort of keeping in touch with. — Pfhorrest

I think you're trivialising those friendships that I had; we knew each other for between 6 and 11 years, regularly saw each other in person, helped each other out etc. Duration depending on the person. In general I agree with you though!

But I don’t believe in conspiracy theories. — NOS4A2

Says the guy who repeated the conspiracy theory that the Capitol rioters were Antifa in disguise...

Now it's down.

Same for Pence. Hopefully a disgruntled employee and not a hack, otherwise that's a concerning security issue. — Michael

We wouldn't want one of those.

That has happened to me too and my takeaway was that this person isn’t actually interested in me personally so it’s no loss to not stay connected with them. — Pfhorrest

:up: To hell with those people who just see you as a +1 to their friend count.

:grin:

The full articles of impeachment against Trump are published here.

The Raffensperger angle seems less prone to interpretation. Given that Trump told his supporters to "remain peaceful" and, eventually, to "go home", I don't think they've got a cat in hell's chance of making the charges stick. But the Raffensperger call was outright and unambiguous criminality; they might conceivably get him on that.

we’ll see. It’s awful that the Democrats have to press impeachment charges, but there really is no choice, they can’t let it go. He has to be held to account, even if the spineless Republicans acquit him for a second time. Hopefully when he’s no longer shielded by privilege some criminal charges can stick and forever remove him from public life, until then he remains a menace to society.

// he also told his followers to ‘fight like hell’, which is somewhat at odds to ‘remaining peaceful’.

On a general note, you can see from the actions of the Trump supporters that his only legitimate support base comes from grievance. In other words, all of those who support him have axes to grind, grudges to bear and a sense of injustice and unfairness. All of which might mitigate for actual social justice, except for the fact that their standard-bearer is a malignant narcissist and pathological liar, whose only real interest in their grievances is as fuel for his public profile. It’s a truly awful co-dependent relationship on a national scale. Years ago the art critic Robert Hughes wrote a book The Culture of Complaint; must look at that again as I’m sure it pinpoints what is behind a lot of the social turmoil in the US on both sides of the divide.

Given that Trump told his supporters to "remain peaceful" and, eventually, to "go home", — Kenosha Kid

Also, note that in that video address, prior to telling his 'supporters' - that would be the mob that had just ransacked the Capitol and murdered a policeman - to 'go home', he told them they were 'special' and 'he loves them very much'. How can that constitute admonishment for their actions?

I said I wouldn’t doubt it. Nonetheless, at least one man was arrested for weapons charges, and of course let go.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2021/01/08/prosecutors-wont-proceed-charges-against-michigan-woman-arrested-capitol-storming/6602945002/

Also, note that in that video address, prior to telling his 'supporters' - that would be the mob that had just ransacked the Capitol and murdered a policeman - to 'go home', he told them they were 'special' and 'he loves them very much'. How can that constitute admonishment for their actions? — Wayfarer

It can't, of course. His more moderate language was undoubtedly through gritted teeth, but nevertheless is less ambiguous than "fight like hell" which doesn't necessarily mean violence. I'm sure Trump was delighted that they took him literally and seriously, but that's not a case.

I said I wouldn’t doubt it. — NOS4A2

That seemed to be the problem.

Here’s another.

Sullivan, who is the founder of Insurgence USA, a social justice group that calls itself anti-fascist and protests police brutality, was detained by Washington police for about an hour and a half Thursday night, a day after he talked to local and national media about what he witnessed Wednesday.

https://www.ksl.com/article/50083768/utah-activist-inside-us-capitol-says-woman-killed-was-first-to-try-and-enter-house-chamber

So you’re arguing ‘plausible deniability’? I really can’t see it. I think should the motion of impeachment pass the House he might again be acquitted in the Senate - but if so that only speaks to the Republican!s lack of principle. Were justice to be done he would be convicted for sure.

Eh, he'll be out soon.

That ought not to relieve him of his massive culpability. I hope the matter is pursued and that he has to cop the consequences.

Culpability for the attack on the Capitol?

:confused: