Circularity is a good thing — unenlightened
Circularity is a good thing — unenlightened
Exactly. The rules of chess are the right rules for chess because those are the rules. There can be other rules, but they are the rules for other games.
If you want to do science, construct experiments; if you want to do mathematics construct proofs. — unenlightened
That's odd. Chess is an invention; naturally, everything about it is arbitrary - for instance, the rules are the way they are because the inventor said so.
Physicalism is not like chess. — TheMadFool
That, sir, is the thesis of atheism, that reality is not the way it is because the inventor said so. But it is not clear to me why it would make a difference even if it is true. Chess is real, whether it was invented or evolved, and the rules are the rules, whatever you may think. — unenlightened
You're missing the point. — TheMadFool
Dude first you deny my analogy on spurious grounds, and then you try and play it back at me in garbled form. No thanks — unenlightened
things that are *not* perceivable, like dark matter — Wayfarer
We can perceive the effects of dark matter, which counts as perceiving dark matter. — Pfhorrest
Otherwise the only things we ever perceive are photons, since all the interactions of the world with our senses are mediated by photons, and we infer everything else about the world through the patterns in those photons. — Pfhorrest
I would argue that really we don't have a definition of what is 'physical — Wayfarer
Such a model describes a perfect gas and is a reasonable approximation to a real gas, particularly in the limit of extreme dilution and high temperature. Such a simplified description, however, is not sufficiently precise to account for the behaviour of gases at high densities.
Physicalism is the thesis that everything is physical, or as contemporary philosophers sometimes put it, that everything supervenes on the physical. The thesis is usually intended as a metaphysical thesis, parallel to the thesis attributed to the ancient Greek philosopher Thales, that everything is water, or the idealism of the 18th Century philosopher Berkeley, that everything is mental. The general idea is that the nature of the actual world (i.e. the universe and everything in it) conforms to a certain condition, the condition of being physical. Of course, physicalists don't deny that the world might contain many items that at first glance don't seem physical — items of a biological, or psychological, or moral, or social nature. But they insist nevertheless that at the end of the day such items are either physical or supervene on the physical.
All perception starts with contact between two physical objects. — Philosophim
"Perception starts with physical objects; something is physical if it can be perceived." Nothing has been said, and nothing has been elucidated. Rather, reality has been made dependent on observation, which actually smacks of idealism. — unenlightened
I'm trying to point out that perception cannot occur without there being a collision of two mediums. Its not an ideal, its simply a fact. — Philosophim
reality has been made dependent on observation, which actually smacks of idealism. — unenlightened
I'll state the physicalist argument for your consideration.
1. To exist -> To be perceivable [Has to be true for physicalism]
2. To be perceivable -> To exist [True]
3. To exist -> To be physical [??? necessary for 4]
4. To be perceivable -> To be physical [from 2, 3 and necessary for 5]
Ergo,
5. To exist -> To be physical [Physicalism] — TheMadFool
A physical cause might have some non-physical effect, such as perhaps a creationist might think of emotional responses to physical stimuli as being an effect on the soul. — Kenosha Kid
So to believe in the soul is to be creationist? — Wayfarer
That is not a logical inference. — Kenosha Kid
The physical (as in physicalism, as in the physical sciences) is that which is empirically verifiable in principle by definition. — Kenosha Kid
A non-physical cause might have a physical effect, such as a non-materialist idea of free will leading to physical movement. — Kenosha Kid
Are there Hindu creationists? — Marchesk
In those cases a psychological (mental) cause has a bodily (physical) effect. — Wayfarer
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