I'm not sure about this. Trump's attempt to go full tilt at this is largely falling on indifferent or deaf ears as his allies - with the exception of the utterly pathetic Giuliani - drop him like the rotten hot potato that he is. Short of some still-possible court shenanigans, the vibe is that people seem to be accepting the results for what they are. But maybe that's 'cause I don't follow Q or Breitbart or whatever close enough. — StreetlightX
He has failed to rouse the rabble, partly because of Biden's statesmanlike patience and inclusiveness, partly too through there being no evidence. — Tim3003
Yes, votes for Trump are fundamentally a rejection of the status quo political class. The evidence for this is Bernie Sanders, who represents the same kind of rejection on the left. Two very different candidates with two very different policies, united by their ability to speak to a loss of faith in the status quo. — Hippyhead
The heart of the problem is that the accelerating development of knowledge is challenging us to look at ever more fundamental issues at an ever faster pace. And we're just not ready. — Hippyhead
Had the GOP run Jeb Bush in the last election... — Hippyhead
with Trumpians.... — praxis
What's driving this at a most fundamental level is the accelerating development of knowledge, which is driving social change at a pace faster than our ability to adapt. — Hippyhead
Furthermore, while I'm ranting, the insistence of SO MANY liberals on insulting rural and working class Americans is an act of pure stupidity. — Hippyhead
Trump surely doesn't have an ideology, but the reason he was elected in the first place isn't a mystery. Call it simply populism: be for the ordinary people against the ruling elite. A deviation from the ordinary, what Trump presented, was enough to get the Republican candidacy and finally the elections. Once, with close race the second time.there is no 'Trumpism'. To create an -ism of any kind, even facism, you need principles. Trump has no principles, only wants and impulses, which he executes spontaneously, as they come to mind. — Wayfarer
they have gotten all they need out of Trump — Echarmion
Do vague platitudes count as lies or truths? Vague platitudes is the language of politicians and lawyers. When you learn how to twist words to mean almost anything, then you can always assert plausible deniability later. — Harry Hindu
I agree with the sentiment, but in its place I'd claim globalisation is the driver. — Tim3003
I watched some of the 2016 presidential debates, I don't know how Jeb looks up close, but from afar, he came across as a kindly suburban accountant type, devoid of anything resembling charisma, originality or wit. Unfortunately, perhaps. — Wayfarer
I'm not convinced we're simply not able to cope. — Echarmion
:rofl:Vague platitudes are neither truths nor lies. — Metaphysician Undercover
I think Trump was a President his supporters simply believed to be more than he was. — ssu
It's called The Cult of Personality. People voted for him because they trusted him as one of their own. In the UK Nigel Farrage had the same appeal. He too came from outside the political establishment. Once Farrage left UKIP it floundered under several leaders. It is not as easy to replace these populist icons as it may appear. It's them, not their policies that voters trust. — Tim3003
The followers of populists actually care for the policy, not the person. They care so much about the policy that they're willing to put up with anyone who gets them closer to that goal. — Echarmion
Quite to the contrary, their lack of virtue is often considered an argument in their favor, as they serve as conduits for the anger of their supporters. It's not who they are as people - it's what they stand for as figureheads. — Echarmion
The followers of populists follow the person as much as the policy. It's been said many times that Trump was policy-lite. His basic stance was of simplistic anti-immigration anti-leftie anti-foreigners tropes that anyone could understand. — Tim3003
His rise was echoed by Farrage in the UK. When he left UKIP and politics altogether it collapsed. At the last election he returned and formed the Brexit Party, which stood in the election with no policies at all, except to achieve Brexit. Millions voted for him. The idea of Brexit was agreed to by many others, but only Farrage was liked and trusted enough to get the poll ratings. (His party ended up being irrelevant because Boris Johnson removed any point in voting for him by copying his Brexiteer stance.) — Tim3003
Populists appeal to voters who are bamboozled by the complexity of policy, and they keep it in simple primary colours. — Tim3003
They are usually political outsiders - as the voters believe themselves to be. These voters will probably not vote at all but just moan about politicians in general until a charmismatic figure comes along to galvanise and organise them.
Where was Trumpism before Trump? His right-wing views were (probably secretly) held by many, but only when he came along as the new Messiah who spoke their black-and-white language did voters wake up and flock to him. — Tim3003
What all the populists have in common is that they call for radical change, and usually change along some simplistic model of the world.
Trumpism before Trump was Obama's "hope and change". — Echarmion
There is an alternative interpretation for the chain of events, which is that UKIP was elected by people wanting Brexit (=policy), and once that was achieved, support collapsed. Farrage, knowing this would happen, conveniently left beforehand. — Echarmion
At first I thought all this business about the election being rigged was just another one of Trump's games. Now I'm thinking he's probably having an ego meltdown, while his family works quietly behind the scenes trying to bring him back down to Earth. — Hippyhead
:up:Vague platitudes are neither truths nor lies. But some people speak intentional lies, and Trump does it all the time. That's what sets him apart from other politicians. You cannot characterize what he says as "spinning the truth" because he speaks in outright lies. — Metaphysician Undercover
The amount of harm, chaos, destruction, etc that they cause is subjective, as is all moral and political truths. — Harry Hindu
I haven't bought into any system. I'm an atheist and an independent voter. I'm not the one that is indoctrinated into some system here. Atheists that are registered Democrats have simply swapped one Big Brother (god) with another(govt). Atheists that are Republicans are just confused. — Harry Hindu
Post-truth bullshit.
If it isn't the truth, then its a lie. — Harry Hindu
Post-truth bullshit.
If it isn't the truth, then its a lie. — Harry Hindu
(I don't often get to agree with MU!) — tim wood
I have been checking Fox and Breitbart in the past days. It looks like the large GOP donors have decided to let this one go, and not take up the opportunity. — Echarmion
In short, this election has strengthened the far right ideological bubble, while completely arresting the momentum of the progressive movement, and will bring back a tepid and meaningless policy framework that will be ineffective in solving any actual problems within the US or that we face globally. Biden will take the blame for the un-going crisis of the pandemic, and the next crisis in the pipes. If a "competent Trump" arises (one who proposes a coherent ideology, inspires a truly loyal cadre of top level bureaucrats at the top and brown shirts at the bottom, and has a grasp of the cogs of government), such a figure will easily defeat Biden, older and even less coherent and with all the same weaknesses as today, in 4 years time. — boethius
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