• david plumb
    75
    The current Hollywood super hero films - are they simply a continuation of the Gods theme that has been around for thousands of years?
  • Pfhorrest
    3.4k
    Yup. The movie “Unbreakable” made this point too.
  • Gus Lamarch
    513
    The current Hollywood super hero films - are they simply a continuation of the Gods theme that has been around for thousands of years?david plumb

    It is more of a tactic to publicize the political bias of producers and the people involved.
  • Pfhorrest
    3.4k
    It is more of a tactic to publicize the political bias of producers and the people involved.Gus Lamarch

    So were gods.
  • Gus Lamarch
    513
    So were gods.Pfhorrest

    Indeed...
  • Sir2u
    2.3k
    The current Hollywood super hero films - are they simply a continuation of the Gods theme that has been around for thousands of years?david plumb

    No, not really. The gods were not just the guides of human destiny but also the creators of humanity. The super heroes do not claim anything like that.
    That part would go to the alien forefathers groups.
  • david plumb
    75
    I doubt if the audience being targeted are going to critically analyse the differences between Gods and super heroes. To this audience the super heroes replace the need for God/Gods and thus continue to negate the need for religion , much as the Frankfurt School intended. Dumbing down of culture is everywhere.
  • david plumb
    75
    Isn't the subliminal message more important?
  • Sir2u
    2.3k
    I doubt if the audience being targeted are going to critically analyse the differences between Gods and super heroes.david plumb

    Not much analysis necessary. I doubt that they are watching these movies looking for a god substitute anyway.
    Most of the people that are influenced by the characters in these movies want to be like the heroes, they want to be more than their pitiful human life lets them be. The rest are just looking for entertainment.

    To this audience the super heroes replace the need for God/Gods and thus continue to negate the need for religion , much as the Frankfurt School intended. Dumbing down of culture is everywhere.david plumb

    If someone has a need for a god they will worship one, but not many superheroes are believable gods even for the dumbest. They might hero worship them and even try to act like them, but how many people really try to act like a god?

    The fact that lots of people watch these superheroes does in no way negate the need for religion, more over it proves the need for them. People need something to look up to, to guide and inspire them. If it was just a continuation as you state, then it would definitely point towards a need for some sort of religion.
  • david plumb
    75


    Not much analysis necessary. I doubt that they are watching these movies looking for a god substitute anyway.

    Are you being philosophical in your analysis? God protects and so do the super heroes. When you are young this can cement itself in your mind and unless you are brought up in a religious family these super heroes substitute a God that you know little about. We all need protection, government knows this. The underlying problem is that the Church is a stumbling block for government as religious people have always preferred to take instruction from the Lord which is why there is so much anti religious rhetoric out there. Get rid of religion and the people are easier to manipulate. China controls its people without much dissent.
  • david plumb
    75


    The fact that lots of people watch these superheroes does in no way negate the need for religion, more over it proves the need for them. People need something to look up to, to guide and inspire them. If it was just a continuation as you state, then it would definitely point towards a need for some sort of religion.

    That seems to analyse the situation in a religious perspective. The reality is that the bare bones of the God question is simply as a protector and no more to most people. Obviously to a religious person who has read the Scriptures thousands of times the meaning is far, far more. To reach the masses in the government needs to then society has to be dumbed down and dismantled in a Derrida way which is what has happened. Popular culture now is dominated by celebrities ( God substitutes again).
    Jesus was a radical and understood the existential way in which we live. The New Covenant is evidence of that.
  • Sir2u
    2.3k
    When you are young this can cement itself in your mind and unless you are brought up in a religious family these super heroes substitute a God that you know little about.david plumb

    How young are you talking about?
    If you see superman when you are maybe 5 to 10 years old you have little idea about what a god actually is. This is actually true for a lot of adults as well. What you would do is play at being him, as many kid falling of roofs trying to fly. You see him as someone to imitate, you try to act like him.
    While, as you said, this can cement itself into their minds but they eventually realize that they can never become him or call on him for help because he is just a comic book or movie character.
    God on the other hand can be asked for help any time you want to, and occasionally it comes.

    The reality is that the bare bones of the God question is simply as a protector and no more to most people.david plumb

    Your reality. With so many millions of people throughout the world worshiping gods who are the creators of everything not many view their god as a simple protector.

    To reach the masses in the government needs to then society has to be dumbed down and dismantled in a Derrida way which is what has happened. Popular culture now is dominated by celebrities ( God substitutes again).david plumb

    You maybe right about the leaders wanting to dumb down the majority of society, but the movies are only a very small part of that. If that was to be a criteria for calling something a god, then a smartphone has a greater impact than super heroes.

    If you do not hold sacred the christian god, why do you capitalize the word?
  • david plumb
    75


    "If you do not hold sacred the Christian god, why do you capitalize the word?"

    "Manners makyeth man" - William of Wykeham.

    "Simples" - Aleksandr Orlov
  • david plumb
    75


    "God on the other hand can be asked for help any time you want to, and occasionally it comes."

    This is my point. God protects us and we call him when in need. The super heroes symbolise the fight against evil, a fight that always eventually ends up with good being the strongest. God is good and also creates the fight against evil within man. Subliminally or not these super heroes substitute the need for God by reverting back to having a god for every purpose. The one God seems banal in comparison.
  • david plumb
    75


    "but the movies are only a very small part of that."

    How many times in history do we overlook this kind of propaganda by dismissing it as of little or no consequence. The beginning of such moments always start subliminally and in small measure. That allows them to grow quicker in a subversive way
  • david plumb
    75


    "Your reality. With so many millions of people throughout the world worshiping gods who are the creators of everything not many view their god as a simple protector."

    "My reality" doesn't sound very philosophical as "your reality" can equally be questioned. The worshipers, in my experience, have little real understanding of God as you may have which makes them easy to control. The Catholic faith is all about Catholicism and maintaining the status quo, too many of the fundamentalists swanning around full of their own importance, berating others and totally oblivious of the hypocrisy surrounding this. Jesus was a radical in his approach to the Jewish Pharisees as they behaved in the same way.
  • Sir2u
    2.3k
    If the people are so stupid that they are substituting comic book super heroes for gods then I ask again, why do they imitate and try to be super heroes but have never imitated nor tried to be gods.
    Yes some old time rulers turned themselves into gods, power trips, but the common everyday man on the street does not do it, why not?
  • david plumb
    75


    "If the people are so stupid that they are substituting comic book super heroes for gods then I ask again, why do they imitate and try to be super heroes but have never imitated nor tried to be gods.
    Yes some old time rulers turned themselves into gods, power trips, but the common everyday man on the street does not do it, why not?"

    Ok, God doesn't go around showing us that good prevails over evil in such a spectacular media driven fashion. We all have a moral base, we all need a moral base and when these morals no longer exist then evil occurs. God is not evidently there for the non believer, He is there only when you choose to see Him. Society needs this moral base obviously but as the Frankfurt School realised it is the religious way of control that hindered the spread of communism as the masses were "happy" to suffer in this life for the sake of a better life in the hereafter. Breaking down the moral tenets of the Church, highlighting for instance the hypocrisy of the clergy and introducing laws allowing gay marriage etc has allowed the liberal Left to take away the authority of the Church . The Frankfurt School left Germany and came to the US back in the thirties and have done a great job of dismantling the need for the Church and introduced a society that is intolerant to intolerance.
  • Mayor of Simpleton
    620
    The current Hollywood super hero films - are they simply a continuation of the Gods theme that has been around for thousands of years?david plumb

    If so, then these current movie gods resemble the Greek, Roman and Norse gods.
  • david plumb
    75


    If so, then these current movie gods resemble the Greek, Roman and Norse gods.

    They do indeed.
  • Nils Loc
    769
    So is this thread really about advocating for belief in the monotheistic God of Roman Catholicism, or any comparable Christian faith?

    Maybe Christian intolerance/corruption ironically lead to the loss of the Church's (what Church?) cultural/political authority.
  • Sir2u
    2.3k
    We all have a moral base, we all need a moral base and when these morals no longer exist then evil occurs.david plumb

    So the evil of the world is now caused by the super hero movies? How does that make sense?

    And the good behavior of these heroes is set as a moral base for the people that don't believe in a god?

    I am beginning to think that you are making less and less sense with each post you make.

    And please learn how to quote properly.
  • Sir2u
    2.3k
    If so, then these current movie gods resemble the Greek, Roman and Norse gods.Mayor of Simpleton

    Some of the characters are actually based on them, Thor, Loke.

    Great choices for a moral base no?
  • david plumb
    75


    "Great choices for a moral base no?"

    That's the whole point, Sir2u. These super heroes represent good and evil without the religious control that goes with it. Governments create fear so you feel safe when they are seen to be our protectors and the Church creates fear ( Hell and damnation) in the same way. It's all about getting away from religious control of the masses by creating a material world that recognises the here and now and not a spiritual world that recognises the here and after.
  • david plumb
    75


    "So the evil of the world is now caused by the super hero movies? How does that make sense?

    And the good behavior of these heroes is set as a moral base for the people that don't believe in a god?

    I am beginning to think that you are making less and less sense with each post you make.

    And please learn how to quote properly."

    A closed mind is a good thing to lose.......Evil in the world is not caused by the super heroes. They are there to substitute the need for a god or gods which has opened the door for thousands of years to corrupt religious systems, systems that have hindered the rise of left wing liberalism. They are a tool amongst many to create the subliminal thought that a god or gods are on the same base level as superheroes, myths but nice thoughts. My phrasing could have been better as the superheroes are the good ones and the evil ones are the characters that represent the evil. Having re-read my response to you I guess you could presume the evil ones are also super heroes but that would miss the point of the whole process.
  • david plumb
    75


    "So is this thread really about advocating for belief in the monotheistic God of Roman Catholicism, or any comparable Christian faith?"

    No, it is about the Frankfurt School critically analysing the reason why communism didn't sweep across the world as was forecast back in the 30's. They decided that the Church ( religion per se ) had control over the masses and set about dismantling the authority of the Church. The super heroes are part of that as are many of the popular woke behaviours that challenge everything that has been accepted as gospel even after the enlightenment. God is simply a need for the masses to believe in a protector- thus the invention of super heroes who let children , in particular, realise that you don't need to believe in God to be good , or even to believe in God .
    Equality doesn't matter in this life as your reward is in the next. Apologies to the religious members but this is simply about discussion, hopefully an open minded one.
    And please learn how to quote properly.Sir2u
  • Nils Loc
    769
    They decided that the Church ( religion per se ) had control over the masses and set about dismantling the authority of the Church.david plumb

    This sounds conspiratorial as if it was a project of planned intent rather than a historical accident of the spread of ideas. The complexity of factors governing historical change makes this theory sound silly. Maybe if the public didn't know how to read at all the authority of religions (Christianity/Islam?) would still properly mediate moral behavior toward a reward in an afterlife.

    Equality doesn't matter in this life as your reward is in the next.david plumb

    For the purpose of trying to make sense of this thread can you say that this quotation is a statement of your own belief? It's somewhat dumbfounding.
  • Sir2u
    2.3k
    A closed mind is a good thing to losedavid plumb

    Maybe it would be a good idea to lose yours then, you seem pretty convinced that you are 100% right and no matter others say you will still be right.

    If one were to say that superheroes have or are taking the place of gods one would have to show some sort of evidence to back up the statements. Thus far you have failed miserable to do so.
    The fact that they are popular, even among religious people, does not make then a god. If that were true then Elvis, Humphrey Bogart, and Obama are also gods.

    For any being to take the place of a god would mean that it would have to fulfill the requisites of that god.
    1. would have to been responsible for the creation of everything.
    2. would have to be the guiding force behind the destiny of mankind
    3. would have to be the moral compass of mankind's morality
    4. would have to be the object of devotion/ worship of humanity

    In the space below please list the Super Heroes that fulfill at least 2 of the above.
  • david plumb
    75


    "Maybe it would be a good idea to lose yours then, you seem pretty convinced that you are 100% right and no matter others say you will still be right."

    If I had a closed mind the question I asked would have been a statement. I am open to argument obviously.

    "If one were to say that superheroes have or are taking the place of gods one would have to show some sort of evidence to back up the statements."

    The same kind of evidence that God exists? Celebrities are also the new gods, they perform the same cultural, psychological role . God needs to disappear, his role in leading, supporting and nurturing people is over. he is no longer needed and the evidence for that is in the empty churches, the so called Christians that pay lip service to their religion. The Church's authority over anything has diminished. Would the majority of people prefer to listen to Jesus' wise mumblings or the unwise, heedless mumblings of a celebrity/media influencer?


    "For any being to take the place of a god would mean that it would have to fulfill the requisites of that god.
    1. would have to been responsible for the creation of everything.
    2. would have to be the guiding force behind the destiny of mankind
    3. would have to be the moral compass of mankind's morality
    4. would have to be the object of devotion/ worship of humanity"

    Again you are missing the point. You can easily create this God substitute without equally creating your points 1-4. People I know do not look at the subliminal substitute of God with points 1-4 in their head. God is points 1-4 to a fundamental Baptist no doubt but, to the guy in the street who probably only thinks about God when he is in a life threatening situation where he knows Batman etc is not going to save him, points 1-4 are irrelevant. Hopefully you will pick up on the point that, when really necessary, Batman is not really a god to most people ( god not God, of course).
  • Mayor of Simpleton
    620


    Minds opened or closed...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=RFO6ZhUW38w

    If anyone can show me one example
    In the history of the world
    Of a single psychic
    Who has been able to prove
    Under reasonable experimental conditions
    That they are able to read minds

    And if anyone can show me one example
    In the history of the world
    Of a single astrologer
    Who has been able to prove
    Under reasonable experimental conditions
    That they can predict future human events
    By interpreting celestial signs

    And if anyone can show me one example
    In the history of the world
    Of a single homeopathic practitioner
    Who has been able to prove
    Under reasonable experimental conditions
    That solutions made of infinitely tiny particles of good stuff
    Dissolved repeatedly into relatively huge quantities of water
    Has a consistently higher medicinal value
    Than a similarly-administered placebo

    And if anyone can show me one example
    In the history of the world
    Of a single spiritual or religious person
    Who has been able to prove
    Either logically or empirically
    The existence of a higher power
    That has any consciousness or interest in the human race
    Or ability to punish or reward humans for their moral choices
    Or that there is any reason other than fear
    To believe in any version
    Of an afterlife
    I will give you my piano
    One of my legs
    And my wife
  • david plumb
    75


    "This sounds conspiratorial"

    There is a need now, interestingly, to try and dumb down the importance of the Frankfurt School theorists. Conspiracy theory seems to have become a term of derision which, without being too conspiratorial again, also further inhibits any challenge to the new status quo.

    "For the purpose of trying to make sense of this thread can you say that this quotation is a statement of your own belief? It's somewhat dumbfounding."

    A belief is too strong a word to use and can be used to pigeon hole someone. When in discussion with the fundamentalists, rather than those paying lip service to their religion, there seems to be a belief that this life is a spring board to the next.
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