Well, it looks like the cease-fire is going to happen, and in my opinion this would clearly show that the Biden administration was simply reluctant to put any pressure on Israel whatsoever, likely in the hopes that stooging for the lobby would get the Dems re-elected. — Tzeentch

:100:

The murderous savage terrorists finally agree to a ceasefire, after killing thousands of babies and reducing the region to rubble. They’ve achieved literally nothing, as far as their stated goals went — Hamas is just as powerful, and still in charge. Israel’s standing in the world has shrunk considerably— so that’s a good thing at least.

So let's pretend you're a woman and you can be dropped down into a random Muslim-majority country or Israel. Which would you pick?

"Israel’s standing in the world has shrunk considerably— so that’s a good thing at least."

I beg to disagree. With Trump's victory, Israel's standing is the highest its been in a long time.

I agree with those points. It seems a risible misunderstanding of reality to prefer Gaza to Israel.

With Trump's victory, Israel's standing is the highest its been in a long time. — RogueAI

:lol:

Yes, keep up the good work of genocide apologetics.

Yes, keep up the good work of genocide apologetics. — Mikie

We killed more Japanese in one night of firebombing than Israel's done in a year. They're not very good at genocide, are they?

We killed more Japanese in one night of firebombing — RogueAI

:lol:

Same stupid justifications, over and over. Maybe a learning disability; probably just willful ignorance.

When everything is genocide, nothing is genocide.

Cool! Bye.

Now as I was saying about the genocide: glad it’s temporarily over, but figure the terrorists will break it. So goes Likud.

Rogue, it's just a very special sort of genocide. It's a genocide where the population is bigger afterwards than before. :lol:

So we should take bets — when will the disgusting terrorist animals continue their genocide? The over/under is at 40 days. I’ll take the under.

When Jews are defending themselves, the "genocide" dial gets turned up to 11.

Not sure if you've noticed, but your boy is currently wanted for crimes against humanity.

That's a very exclusive little club he made himself, and by extension Israel, a part of.

Netanyahu is corrupt as the day is long. He's also a Jew leading his country in a time of war, so of course he's "wanted for crimes against humanity". Whenever Israel does anything beyond harsh language, it's a crime against humanity.

You're playing some victim card here now? Oof... You must be quite far gone.

Whenever Israel does anything beyond harsh language, it's a crime against humanity. — RogueAI

Yeah, everyone knows calling out a genocide is antisemitic.

"Trump says Jordan, Egypt should take more Palestinians from Gaza"
https://www.reuters.com/world/trump-says-jordan-egypt-should-take-more-palestinians-gaza-2025-01-26/

For the joy of the whiners in this thread, apparently, the so-called genocide/cleansing of the Palestinians continues "thanks to" (?) Trump after the "terrific" cease-fire Israel has destroyed all it could destroy of all its strategic enemies "thanks to" (?) Biden.

Why call it "so-called", if Trump helps Netanyahu's dream to be fulfilled? The next issue will be to argue that "ethnic cleansing" isn't genocide, because it isn't mentioned in the definition of a genocide (as is for example of forcibly transferring children of the group to another group, which Russia is doing in Ukraine). For the Netanyahu government, removal of Palestinians from the borders of Isreal (which include Gaza, West Bank, Golan Heights) seems to be a plausible long term solution. And obtainable.

If the destabilization of especially Jordan (and Egypt) is the next issue on the agenda, then hardly anything else would be more effective that this. The last thing that the governments of these two countries want to be is willing participants and enablers of the ultra-nationalist zionists plans for moving all Palestinians out of Israel. As Jordan had to fight earlier the PLO earlier and the Egyptians are no backers of Hamas, the last thing for the two countries is to have huge refugee camps of Palestinians with Hamas.

Also, the fact that the border between Jordan and Egypt have stayed peaceful is because both of the countries armed forces can ensure their side of the peace deal with Israel. That's what an actual peace means. Hamas in the refugee camps won't have none of that.

And let's remember that their is an enthusiastic lust for war within the Netanyahu administration, who insist the war to continue. And why not? It isn't going to be that there's any sanctions hurled at Israel because of this, so simply keep on...

(Times of Israel, 15th Jan 2025) Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich insisted Wednesday that the war in the Gaza Strip must continue, but did not explicitly say whether he will back or oppose an emerging ceasefire deal to release hostages held by Hamas in the Palestinian enclave.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is reportedly pressuring Smotrich to resist a call from allied far-right National Security Minister Itamar Ben Gvir to exit the government if it approves the hostage agreement on the table.

Ben Gvir has now exited the administration, Smotrich is still hanging on. So the cease-fire is for six weeks. What happens then, we'll see.

It's a ridiculous abuse of language to call the scattering of a people genocide. Otherwise Jews would be speaking about the Babylonian genocide or the Roman genocide -- even then the English are guilty of genocide against the Jews.

Exile is a world apart from genocide. Sometimes in exile things improve for the people. It allows them to rebuild in a better way. I think Jordan and Egypt (and possibly Indonesia) taking Palestinian refugees would be a great solution and I hope it works out.

Will the Israeli-terrorist genocide continue? That’s the only question. Already it looks like they want to continue freely killing babies and leveling the entire region (mostly rubble already) to the ground.

“Israel has accused Hamas of breaking the truce.” Right. We’ll figure out a story later.

Do you consider Hamas a terrorist organization?

Do you consider Hamas a terrorist organization? — BitconnectCarlos

Do you consider Likud a terrorist organization?

And in America they lynch negroes!

You've got the playbook down.

Funny coming from the genocide apologist.

Forced transfer or forced settlement has been used numerous of times, famously used by Stalin and the Soviet Union to control it's Empire. Ethnic cleansing came to define similar actions only during the Yugoslav Civil War. I hardly think it's so positive as you depict it to be:

Sometimes in exile things improve for the people. It allows them to rebuild in a better way. — BitconnectCarlos

So like the Pogroms in Eastern Europe that drove many Jews to migrate to America was ...actually a splendid thing to happen? :chin:

Yet as I've stated already, Azerbaijan did use ethnic cleansing / forced transfers, yet simply declaring publicly that nobody will be forced out, it worked perfectly. No condemnations whatsoever! Thing seems to be forgotten. Because they (the Azeris) didn't tell publicly that they want every single Armenian out.

I think Jordan and Egypt (and possibly Indonesia) taking Palestinian refugees would be a great solution and I hope it works out. — BitconnectCarlos

It's not a great solution and likely won't happen. It is as delusional to especially think that it's a great solution as is the anti-semitist thinking that Israel is a Western colonial project and the European Jews that have migrated there ought to migrate back to where they came from. After all, the Crusader States were for longer than present Israel has been around.

And no, I'm not saying that to be any solution, but just an example of the offensive "solutions" that people give.

So like the Pogroms in Eastern Europe that drove many Jews to migrate to America was ...actually a splendid thing to happen? — ssu

The pogroms aren't a great example. If this exile were to happen, it's because the Palestinians were defeated by another civilization. But yes, exiles can have value. It's about how the culture understands the exile and what they do from there. I understand that exile is no walk in the park, but it's a completely different matter from genocide.

I was thinking more along the lines of the Babylonian exile for the Jews which, after being thoroughly defeated by the Babylonians, spent the next ~70 years writing much of the Torah (and many of the other 66 books of the bible) and experiencing cultural flourish.

Yet as I've stated already, Azerbaijan did use ethnic cleansing / forced transfers, yet simply declaring publicly that nobody will be forced out, it worked perfectly. No condemnations whatsoever! Thing seems to be forgotten. Because they (the Azeris) didn't tell publicly that they want every single Armenian out.

Then that seems like that could be a good model for Israel to follow, but I agree that this is unlikely to actualize given Egypt and Jordan don't seem interested at all. I certainly agree that offering voluntary resettlement is much, much preferable.

It's not a great solution and likely won't happen. It is as delusional to especially think that it's a great solution as is the anti-semitist thinking that Israel is a Western colonial project and the European Jews that have migrated there ought to migrate back to where they came from. — ssu

Jordan has a few million Palestinians already and country seems able to handle to them. In any case, I agree that the plan is a longshot, but if Egypt, Jordan, and Indonesia were to accept the refugees (and the refugees were to go willingly, ideally) it would be a dream solution for Israel.

The Bosnian Genocide

Srebrenica Massacre

Several high-profile individuals were tried and found guilty of genocide.

You'll note that whether or not the genocide is successful is no factor. And you'll also note that a nation need not kill millions in order to be guilty of genocide. In the Srebrenica massacre 8,000 men were killed. This act was ruled unanimously an act of genocide in 2004, and the ruling was again upheld in 2007.

Article II

In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with
intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as
such:

(a) Killing members of the group;

(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its
physical destruction in whole or in part;

(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;

(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group. — Convention on the Prevention of the Crime of Genocide

Intent is of great importance here (which is why comparisons with Allied bombing during WW2 are moot). Unfortunately for Israel, several high-profile politicians have stated their genocidal intent outright and in public.

This is why Netanyahu is currently wanted for crimes against humanity.

All that's left is for the apologists to have their "Are we the baddies?" moment.

The pogroms aren't a great example. If this exile were to happen, it's because the Palestinians were defeated by another civilization. But yes, exiles can have value. It's about how the culture understands the exile and what they do from there. I understand that exile is no walk in the park, but it's a completely different matter from genocide. — BitconnectCarlos

The issue here is that the Palestinian identity is fixed on Palestine, the territory, just as Zionism has fixed the Jewish identity on the land of Israel, the same territory. A Palestinian abroad aren't migrants, but see themselves as refugees. Thus they won't adapt to be Americans, Egyptians, French or German or whoever. For many Jewish people their religion is not their national identity, but for Israeli Jews zionism is part of their identity. Similarly it is for the Palestinians: the Nakbah and those cherished keys to their old now nonexistent houses that the families hold on as relics is what makes the Palestinian identity.

Peoples identities are lost either by cultural assimilation or by genocide. The sad reality in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is that there is no option of cultural assimilation. Israel is the homeland for Jews, not a "multiethnic country that celebrates it's diversity". The conflict itself is part of the national character of both Jewish Israelis and the Palestinians. And when you have different laws to different people, this is totally evident. And this is why there is no "great solution" for this conflict. Only bad ones.

Yes, Palestinianism exists as a negation of Israel. It is also around 60 years old. The Jewish connection to the land goes back over 2000 years. It is even mentioned in the Quran -- Judea as home of the Jews. "Palestinianism" is nothing but a front for the expansion of Islam. An identity built purely on revanchism.

The Jews have lost Judea multiple times. Diaspora communities are formed. Jews accept the situation and focus on other things. They don't endlessly lament the loss and raise Jewish children to murder the occupier. Exile historically moderates Jewish theology and causes reflection. The more I read about the history in this region the more it is made clear to me that victory emboldens, defeat moderates. Palestinian society needs moderation and frankly deserves destruction.

The Arabs tried to destroy the Jews in 1948. The Jews managed to turn the tide and the Arabs fled. Then some of those Arabs claim perpetual victimhood. Yes, when mortars are being fired from Arab villages Jewish forces will attack those villages.

Regarding different laws, all Israeli citizens have the same laws. But yes, Palestinians under the PA or Hamas will have their own laws.

EDIT: One last, but important point, cultural assimilation is conceivably a form of genocide. The Philistines are no more not because they were slaughtered en masse, but because they were absorbed by the cultures around them and they lost their distinctive group identity.

"Palestinianism" is nothing but a front for the expansion of Islam. An identity built purely on revanchism. — BitconnectCarlos

I disagree. The PLO doesn't have it's roots in Islamism, as Hamas has. As the area had been part of the Ottoman Empire, with the exception of Egypt, there hadn't existed Lebanon, Syria or Jordan as we now know these countries now. But this isn't at all some kind of refutation. Just as there hadn't been an independent state called Finland, that doesn't mean that there hadn't existed Finns. And anyway, I despise people who talk about "the artificiality" of any people compared to others, when millions of people do relate being of a nationality. Usually these people have very dubious incentives for this strange argumentation.

Palestinian identity has basically emerged from the conflict itself. These aren't citizens of Egypt or citizens of Jordan. They aren't Lebanese or Syrian either. Even when it was Jordan holding the West Bank until 1967, even then the country had to maneuver tightly on the international stage. And of course in the 1948 the neighboring Arab states weren't defending the Palestinians, but trying to carve up the former British Mandate.

Regarding different laws, all Israeli citizens have the same laws. But yes, Palestinians under the PA or Hamas will have their own laws. ↪ssu — BitconnectCarlos

And here lies the absurdity of the situation: you are referring to PA and Palestinians under Hamas, but then again would they have then their independent statehood? No. Hence they aren't the responsibility of Israel, but then they cannot be responsable in the way a sovereign state is of it's borders. And in the era of Trump, just shove them somewhere else.