Bonus points to you for being among the few on this forum to condemn Putin for the bloodshed and horror he's about to unleash. :up:

Thanks, Wayfarer, we already know that. And there is nothing you can do about it. So, you might as well relax and think of how we could get China to return Tibet to the Tibetans.

The FT is interesting. It has to present more or less tolerable view of the world to the people who own it, they can't be like CNN, almost never having dissident voices on. — Manuel

I agree. The FT does provide an insight into interesting financial dealings that are going on across the globe. But its owners Nikkei are Japanese and the Japanese are firmly aligned with America. Unless Nikkei are a front for someone else ....

Well called in advance from you.

The next thing I assume, at least at some timetable, is that these "independent countries" will hold referendums or simply decide otherwise to join the Russian Federation. Something quite similar how the Baltic states "voluntarily joined" the Soviet Union.

What is also notable is that Russia is also strengthening it's grip on Belarus. Next Sunday Belarus will have a referendum basically for Lukashenko to continue as president (for life) and for the parliament to have less power, but the changes will also mean that Belarus as a nuclear-weapons free zone and the (now theoretical) neutrality of the country are going to be done away with. (See Belarus seeks to amend its constitution to host Russian nuclear weapons) It's telling that it was Russia that openly lobbied for the changes in the Belarussian constitution. After the huge protests against his rule, Lukashenko is too weak to be as independent as he was in 2014.

As Putin is obviously trying to reconstitute and reconquer the Russian (Soviet) Empire, he truly is the modern imperialist in the genuine sense.

↪Wayfarer Well called in advance from you. — ssu

Indeed. And you...from 5yrs ago:

https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/731/putins-breakthrough-in-political-ideology-the-new-komintern/p1

The Russian foreign policy objectives and it's agenda are totally logical. Going against NATO, against the Transatlantic connection and the EU is obvious as these supranational organizations make it possible for smaller countries in the zone of influence of Russia, like the Baltic States, to go against Russia. If relations in Europe were done on a one-to-one basis, Russia would have a very influential position. But if it has to negotiate with the EU, it is in a disadvantage. Hence the anti-EU stance of Russia. And the anti-NATO stance of Russia ought to be obvious to everybody.

Yet with supporting clandestinely Trump, giving loans to the French National Front and having connections to far-right and anti-immigration / anti-EU parties, Russia now has hit a populist streak that likely it didn't think would be possible. Above all, it's de facto enemy, is in total dissarray.
[ ... ]
Russia and it's intelligence services are winning.

I think things are getting worse, not better... — ssu

***

Now:

As Putin is obviously trying to reconstitute and reconquer the Russian (Soviet) Empire, he truly is the modern imperialist... — ssu

The dangerous thing about all of this.
Imperialism. It's not just about Russia.

Putin and Trump both backed Brexit.
The nasty piece of work, Boris Johnson, is still in power despite all his lies and corruption.
To say the very least.

Rule Britannia.
It's the scariest of times. With no apparent way out...another dictator...who cares little for the vulnerable.
It's all about keeping the Tories in power - any predictions on that?

Covid laws and free mass testing are to be swept away across England after Rishi Sunak won a cabinet battle on cutting the cost of the pandemic, prompting fears that the poor and vulnerable will pay the price.

Boris Johnson announced plans to end free testing for the general public from 1 April, saying it was time for people to “get our confidence back”.

People who test positive for Covid will no longer have to isolate by law from this Thursday – and from April will not even be advised to stay at home if infected, the prime minister said. — Guardian article

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/21/boris-johnson-says-free-covid-tests-in-england-will-end-on-1-april

I'm grateful to everyone who has clear vision and can call out what is happening...for what it is.

Thanks for the reference.

I think it would good to say one totally obvious thing:

If one is against imperialism, it is logical to be against all imperialism no matter who or which side has these imperial aspirations.

It is obvious that we have many examples of imperialism and actions totally similar to imperialism done by the West too, yet this surely isn't a reason why then to dismiss imperialism of others. Or at worst, to defend those who are in opposition to the West in their own acts of imperialism and become a spokesperson for one side. One then is just a hypocrite for whom the values themselves don't need anything. After all, this is a philosophy forum, so values and ideas ought to matter.

(And those who are actually against imperialism will be both accused of being anti-American and being pro-American by those that think they have to choose a side in these matters.)

Putin and Trump both backed Brexit. — Amity

Do note that Putin also actively encouraged Scottish independence. When you think of it, the Scottish Independence Party and UKIP/Brexit crowd are quite in opposite camps. But that doesn't matter. For Russia, there is no other logic than to a) break up Atlanticism and NATO, b) break up the EU and c) break up Western countries, if possible. I think the only case where Putin wasn't active (or didn't care) was with the possible secession of Catalonia from Spain. Spain I guess isn't so important for Russia.

Let's say that the United Kingdom understood when it had lost the empire. The French did also, but after far many wars. Putin's Russia, or basically Putin himself and his cabal, have not understood that they truly lost the empire. The Soviet empire collapsed in such an instant, Putin likely doesn't believe that it was something permanent. He genuinely believes that he can push Ukrainians to be part of Russia and they will accept their "historical" place.

Perhaps only now we have to see the wars that typically result in the collapse of an Empire. That's really a tragedy, when the Soviet Union did collapse rather peacefully 30 years ago.

If one is against imperialism, it is logical to be against all imperialism no matter who or which side has these imperial aspirations. — ssu

Shame that you don't do as you preach though, seeing that you condone Chinese, Turkish, and American imperialism.

As Putin is obviously trying to reconstitute and reconquer the Russian (Soviet) Empire, he truly is the modern imperialist in the genuine sense. — ssu

You obviously don't understand the term "empire". Donetsk and Luhansk are tiny patches of land compared to Russia. They do not amount to "empire" by any stretch of imagination. Though it may be different with people from the Finnish outback where imagination apparently serves as substitute for knowledge .... :grin:

Delusional nonsense and lies, as you haven't been long in this forum. I remember well those who defended on the previous site the invasion of Iraq and deemed me anti-american.

That you aren't against the annexations that Russia has done is enough for everyone to understand your position in this thread.

Enough of your trolling.

As Putin is obviously trying to reconstitute and reconquer the Russian (Soviet) Empire, he truly is the modern imperialist in the genuine sense. — ssu

Yes, Putin is trying to rebuild the lost glorious national power that Stalin won after the war. If he really cared about the future of Russia he would be more occupied with the problems and potential of melting and burning Siberia.

Delusional nonsense and lies — ssu

Enough of your trolling. — ssu

:up:

If he really cared about the future of Russia he would be more occupied with the problems and potential of melting and burning Siberia. — magritte

I think it's going to melt on its own. NOAA says 2022 will be the hottest year on record.

Though it may be different with people from the Finnish outback where imagination apparently serves as substitute for knowledge .... :grin: — Apollodorus

Friendly banter is one thing but considering your general adversarial tone towards ssu, this seems more like part of a pattern of ad-homs. So, stop it, please.

I remember well those who defended on the previous site the invasion of Iraq and deemed me anti-american. — ssu

Well, that only demonstrates some people's tendency to compulsively give in to ideologically (or psychologically) motivated knee-jerk reactions. And your double standards.

Delusional nonsense and lies, as you haven't been long in this forum. — ssu

I don't think I need to be "long in this forum" to see that tiny patches of land like Donetsk and Luhansk DO NOT amount to "empire" by any stretch of imagination.

Tibet has an area of 2,500,000 sq km. The Donbas region where Donetsk and Luhansk are located is only a few thousand sq km, and not all of it is controlled by Russia. Yet for some strange reason you keep blabbering on about "Russian empire", but not "Chinese empire"!

By your logic, Gibraltar makes Britain an "empire" .... :lol:

Enough of your trolling. — ssu

If I was getting responses this stupid (especially see above), I would just give up.

Some developments:

Germany put a halt to the Nordstream 2.

Germany on Tuesday halted the Nord Stream 2 Baltic Sea gas pipeline project, designed to double the flow of Russian gas direct to Germany, after Russia formally recognized two breakaway regions in eastern Ukraine.

Europe's most divisive energy project, worth $11 billion, was finished in September, but has stood idle pending certification by Germany and the European Union.

Similarly here the government is going to make a new risk analysis of a nuclear reactor a Russian company was just starting to build here. The obvious issue is that Putin's Russia is a totally unreliable provider of energy. Germany really has to look what to do with it's energy policy.

Other developments....

(Global News) Russian President Vladimir Putin asked the country’s parliament on Tuesday for a permission to use military force outside the country.

Putin’s letter to the upper house of parliament would formalize a Russian military deployment to rebel regions in eastern Ukraine, a day after the Russian leader recognized their independence.

It may also herald Putin’s intention to launch a broader attack on Ukraine. Western leaders earlier said Russian troops had moved into the country’s east – and the U.S. called it an “invasion.”

Lawmakers are expected to quickly rubber-stamp Putin’s request during a session Tuesday. Putin signed friendship treaties earlier in the day with the two rebel regions that envisage the deployment of the Russian military there.

If I was getting responses this stupid (especially see above), I would just give up. — Baden

Well, giving the benefit of the doubt to someone that has different views from yours is important in a forum like this, but up to a point. Ad hominems are just a sign of there's not much the other side has to argue.

Germany really has to look what to do with it's energy policy. — ssu

So what are their alternatives?

So what are their alternatives? — frank

a) Costly buying from the SPOT-market, b) extend the use of nuclear energy as they have still three nuclear power plants working which are planned to be shut off this year and even switch on again some power plants that have been shut down, but still can be brought back to operation (which would be suicide for the Greens in the government), c) go humbly to your neighbors like Poland or France and ask to buy electricity at a high price, d) Make deals either with Norway or the US or others to buy LNG from them and have a crash program to build a LNG port in Germany or e) all of the above or some of the options mentioned above. Then there is of course option f) Act surprised when you have power outages and blame them on something, the weather, climate change, Putin's cyberwarfare or whatever you can invent that would seem acceptable to the ignorant voters.

Likely we won't see rolling blackouts in Germany, but who knows. It's basically a self inflicted wound as Germany opted to shut down all nuclear energy because of the Fukushima hysteria.

I think the Germans didn't see any problem earlier as the trade in energy went all fine with the Soviet Union during the Cold War. But history doesn't repeat itself and Putin has been active in using all tools he has in his "hybrid warfare".

That probably means the interruption of work on the pipeline from Russia is temporary. They'll quietly go back to it when this is over.

Too bad. It would be a good idea to go back to nuclear.

I wonder if people now finally would realize how deeply incompetent the republicans are when Trump calls Putin "genius" and Tucker and Fox news continue to defend Putin's actions.

It should be absolutely clear how dangerous Trump and the republican apathy towards a war crisis like this is. The danger was never that Trump would hit the big red button, it would be that he would let someone like Putin create a serious security risk on a global scale and not act in time to contain it. It is becoming clear that the republican party is unable to sustain a stable political line and if any conflicts occur during Trump's next 4 years (if Trump gets re-elected), it could escalate the world into a major international conflict. If this happens, the world will view the incompetence of US, Trump and Republicans in such a serious matter that it could break Nato in half. The biggest issue is that US could be isolated, no one wants to be connected to such an unstable nation and EU might initiate a new military alliance without the US.

I don't think people realize just how incompetent Trump and the Republicans are on the world stage. It doesn't matter if you vote republican, like them or oppose them, everyone with any rational thought would agree that the republican party isn't what it used to be and it should be considered a great security risk if republicans were to ever oppose Putin in a situation like the current one. To have Trump call Putin genius, Fox news blindly criticizing Biden in a way that almost sounds like Russian propaganda and a republican party who mainly stays silent through all of this is really fucking serious.

It should be absolutely clear how dangerous Trump and the republican apathy towards a war crisis like this is. — Christoffer

:100:

Hopefully it will split the GOP soon and demolish their chances of winning. That'll learn 'em.

This is going to be a very nasty conflict, what with cyber-attacks, trade boycotts, and sanctions. Supply-chain fuckups, energy shortages, economic blowback all over the world. Very, very nasty.

would — Christoffer

if — Christoffer

could — Christoffer

If — Christoffer

could — Christoffer

could — Christoffer

...so...let's have a war!

Just in case...

It would be a good idea to go back to nuclear. — frank

Side-note: Rolls Royce Small Modular Reactors.

The Ukraine Crisis
To backtrack a little for my understanding and clarification:

I had asked why other world leaders let this happen for so long...?
I meant that this Crisis didn't just come out of the blue.
Putin's actions as a dictator - internal suppression and external disruption - led directly to this point.
I admit to being ignorant. So when discussing matters in the philosophy of politics, I have questions.

'Prevention is better than cure' - perhaps sounds a little quaint but if we don't wish our 'democracies' to progress/regress - slide to a fascistic, autocratic state where elections and referenda are swayed, tampered with and fought over, what is to be done?

How do we, the voters, become more knowledgeable and aware of the best evidence rather than soundbites. And if soundbites like 'A Plan is better than no Plan' effectively convince, then why are they not used by the opposition?
The Labour leader (Keir Starmer) answered this on a Ch4 interview - it seems they are above this - they are all about values...hmmm.

[ Unfortunately, the video of the interview isn't available. This is a 25min podcast - an analysis of the interview by Cathy Newman.
https://www.channel4.com/news/is-the-next-election-labours-to-lose ]

***

The US and European nations have long opposed Russian territorial aggression on Ukraine. The US has been screaming blue murder for the last six weeks, which a lot of people say is simply scare-mongering, although it's obviously not.
— Wayfarer

Yes. Words come easy. Some are genuine.
Putin has been a dangerous, now totally paranoid, dictator for how long?
How many leaders have shaken his hand and been showered upon... — Amity

And it is a mutual process which has been going on, pretty much unseen, for a long time.
Just one tiny but important example of Russian interests/influence in the UK, handed to them on a plate by Boris Johnson, the Tory party.

The ennoblement of Mr Lebedev, son of a former KGB agent, who owns the Evening Standard and The Independent, comes days after the intelligence and security committee warned of the growing influence of a “Russian elite” in British life. — The Times - Evgeny Lebedev son of KGB agent handed a seat in the House of Lords

With very little outcry.
Can you imagine the concerns, the Tory media field day, if a Labour leader/government had done this...

***

Do note that Putin also actively encouraged Scottish independence. When you think of it, the Scottish Independence Party and UKIP/Brexit crowd are quite in opposite camps. But that doesn't matter. For Russia, there is no other logic than to a) break up Atlanticism and NATO, b) break up the EU and c) break up Western countries, if possible. — ssu

Thanks, I didn't know of Putin's interference and the benefits to him. Or perhaps I did but have forgotten. Yes, most of Scotland voted to stay in the EU.
Scottish votes seem to count for nothing, and any referendum has to be allowed by Westminster...
The Brexit vote was an easy victory, based on big lies and promises. Look where we are now...

***

Then there is of course option f) Act surprised when you have power outages and blame them on something, the weather, climate change, Putin's cyberwarfare or whatever you can invent that would seem acceptable to the ignorant voters. — ssu

There are always excuses and blame on any other but the real actors. Unfortunately, most voters are ignorant; kept in the dark or don't care enough to see beyond their own way of thinking. Isn't that where philosophy should enter the picture? Or at least critical thinking.

As things stand, it seems that political education is being changed by the Tories. A snippet:

Empire and socialism
The British empire and imperialism also make an appearance. While the document says the reformation and renaissance are unlikely to be an issue:

For more recent historical events including those which are particularly contentious and disputed, political issues may be presented to pupils. This includes many topics relating to empire and imperialism, on which there are differing partisan political views, and which should be taught in a balanced manner.

The framing hundreds of years of exploitation and occupation simply as a ‘partisan’ issue, surely downplays the continuing impacts of imperialism around the world.
[ ... ]

The Tory choice of topics is telling. Why Israel/Palestine, BLM and empire? Of all issues, why are these being treated as if two equally legitimate sides deserve to be heard. Also significant, is the government decision to reinforce with guidance what already appears to be law.We need to question why they are doing this. — The Canary - Tory Guidance on teaching politics

***

Boris Johnson yesterday unveiled “the first barrage” of sanctions against Russian business interests in response to the country’s movement of troops into Ukraine.

Yet the measures scarcely scratch the surface of the extensive business links between Moscow and Britain. From the dozens of Russian companies listed in London, to BP’s 20 per cent stake in Kremlin-backed Rosneft and the flow of commodities to the UK, Anglo-Russian commerce is under intense scrutiny as the prime minister and his counterparts in the EU and America mull further sanctions. — The Times - Unpicking Russia's Web of UK Interests

***

The Ukraine Crisis. They need all the help they can get, no?
The choice to stay and fight - or flee to a safe place - some have no choice.

“If it comes to an invasion, it will be total war like in 1939. The whole country will be fighting back, there will be a massive resistance. The west should know there will be a large number of refugees too, maybe 5 to 10 million.”

Those determined to fight include Oleg Sentsov, a film director from Crimea who became a national hero after he was detained in his home city in 2014 and convicted of terrorism in a Russian military court. Human rights groups denounced it as a show trial.

He spent five years in Russian jails, including in Siberia where the cold severely damaged his health, before he was released in a prisoner swap in 2019. He says he is ready to fight, even as his latest film, Rhino, is feted at festivals.

“I will be in uniform. I have some military training and I know how to act in war,” he said in an interview at a central Kyiv cafe, hours before Putin announced his plans to recognise breakaway regions of Ukraine. “The main thing I learned in this life is not to be afraid. In such a difficult time, I will not be the person running from my country.” — The Guardian - Ukrainians ready for resistance

Brave citizens fighting for their lives.
We look on and talk about it...pretty powerless, huh?

@jamalrob
What's the weather like where you are?
Any thoughts you can share?

Brave citizens fighting for their lives. — Amity

Yes. Brave, brave neo-nazis...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/05/ukraine-women-fighting-frontline

...powerless, but for their human rights abuses...

https://www.amnesty.org/en/documents/EUR50/040/2014/en/

Oh, the humanity!

*Pre-WWIII conditions occur under president Biden*

Liberals: How could Trump do this???

*Pre-WWIII conditions occur under president Biden*

Liberals: How could Trump do this??? — StreetlightX

It's all Putins doing. The US president isn't a watchdog for WWIII. But when Trump calls Putin genius, that is a major red flag. Throw both the democrats and republicans out the window and just back up for a moment and look at the bigger picture. Putin is a major threat because he's a fucking lunatic. To have a former president and someone who might take office again, call Putin a genius is serious.

A lot of people will die and there will be a major hit to the security of the world if Putin invades Ukraine. So who can defend such a statement from Trump? How can the blatant pro-Putin and apathy of the republican party be something the US people would support? What the fuck is wrong with people?

Hello and thank you for the links.
I note that the first article is from 2015 with a particular focus on a woman's group.

Do you think that all the citizens who must stay and fight against an invasion are the same?

As I said, I don't know enough about what is going on...the various political and citizen groups involved in the resistance against Putin. I'm here to learn.

Putin is a major threat because he's a fucking lunatic. To have a former president and someone who might take office again, call Putin a genius is serious.

A lot of people will die and there will be a major hit to the security of the world if Putin invades Ukraine. So who can defend such a statement from Trump? How can the blatant pro-Putin and apathy of the republican party be something the US people would support? What the fuck is wrong with people? — Christoffer

Exactly this :100:

It’s an abject failure if the American system that Trump isn’t in jail already for sedition.