I wonder if they’ll segregate the vaccinated, just to keep us safe. We need to slow the spread.

Most reported U.S. Omicron cases have hit the fully vaccinated -CDC

Most of the 43 COVID-19 cases caused by the Omicron variant identified in the United States so far were in people who were fully vaccinated, and a third of them had received a booster dose, according to a U.S. report published on Friday.

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) said that of the 43 cases attributed to Omicron variant, 34 people had been fully vaccinated. Fourteen of them had also received a booster, although five of those cases occurred less than 14 days after the additional shot before full protection kicks in.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/most-reported-us-omicron-cases-have-hit-fully-vaccinated-cdc-2021-12-10/

in South Africa 75% of those hospitalised with Omicrom are unvaccinated. Current vaccines still offer around 70% protection against Omicron:

None of what he says contradicts the Reuters article, that "most of the 43 COVID-19 cases caused by the Omicron variant identified in the United States so far were in people who were fully vaccinated, and a third of them had received a booster dose, according to a U.S. report published on Friday."

We need to slow the spread. — NOS4A2

Why? Omicron spreads faster and appears to cause less severe disease. This should be seen as a great opportunity to achieve herd immunity faster. More infected=more natural immunity, this is a good thing.

I know. It was sarcasm.

Of course. Most folk are vaccinated.

The vaccinated folk get a cold. The unvaccinated folk get to go to the ICU.

I question the efficacy of the vaccine. Yes, a whole bunch of people are going to call me names for it, but seriously consider: Vaccination for small pox= no more small pox. Vaccination for measles= no more measles. Same for polio; chicken pox, mumps. You get my point.

Then comes covid...

Prior to vaccine: Mask, social distance, limit movement (domestic and international), decrease social interaction, work from home when possible. Virus spreading, people dying.

During vaccine campaign: Mask, social distance, limit movement (domestic and international) , decrease social interaction, work from home when possible. Virus spreading, people dying.

After achieving fully vaccinated status : Mask, social distance, limit movement (domestic and international), decrease social interaction, work from home when possible. Virus spreading, people dying.

I see zero difference, outside of increased division and resentment on both sides of the vaccination issue.

How does a government “slow the spread” if those with colds are given a pass to congregate?

The vaccinated folk get a cold. The unvaccinated folk get to go to the ICU. — Banno

Covid strikes...

...The vaccinated: 80% don't know they had/have it.
...The unvaccinated: 80% don't know they had/have it.

Vaccinated go to the ICU less than the Unvaccinated, true. However, of the 20% that feel symptoms, 75% will not end up at the hospital. Of the 25% that end up at the hospital, most will go home from the emergency department. Yes, the rest will go to ICU, and some will die. Some in the ICU are also vaccinated, and some of them will die as well.

No one ever mentions that the Israeli ICUs are evenly split with vaccinated/unvaccinated. Let's continue to ignore that detail, it doesn't play well.

Also, if you can catch a cold, you can catch Covid, so your anti-covid steps have failed eh. Just that simple.

No one ever mentions that the Israeli ICUs are evenly split with vaccinated/unvaccinated. — Book273

Well, I can't find support for that - what I found says 75% of new covid cases are unvaccinated. Considering that only around 17% of the population are unvaccinated, that's an extraordinary win for vaccination. 60% of deaths are amongst the unvaccinated, who make up only 17% of the population.

Vaccination is working.

How does a government “slow the spread” if those with colds are given a pass to congregate? — NOS4A2

If the consequence of congregating is a cold, then there is little need to slow the spread. Any rules still standing are only there to protect the unvaccinated.

Yes, by not getting vaccinated those folk are making it harder for everyone.

Vaccinated go to the ICU less than the Unvaccinated, true. However, of the 20% that feel symptoms, 75% will not end up at the hospital. Of the 25% that end up at the hospital, most will go home from the emergency department. Yes, the rest will go to ICU, and some will die. Some in the ICU are also vaccinated, and some of them will die as well. — Book273

There is no "however" being demonstrated. It's more of a "look over here". The vaccine keeps hospital admissions down. Seems like a worthwhile goal considering the state of our healthcare "marketplace".

60% of deaths are amongst the unvaccinated, — Banno

So 40% of the deaths are vaccinated.

75% of new covid cases are unvaccinated. — Banno

So 25% of new covid cases are vaccinated.

Vaccination is working. — Banno

Sure, but no where near as well as we are being led to believe. So we are mandated to receive a vaccine we don't want (otherwise they wouldn't have to mandate it), that should help, sort of. It was a weak premise when it was initiated and is weakening further as time passes. First the vaccine, then a booster, then maybe another booster, then, and likely, an annual booster too. This is poor medicine to mandate on people.

I would add that up to 30% of the vaccination efficacy can be attributed to the placebo effect, so really, how well is it actually working?

I don't really work in a healthcare marketplace. We don't do a wallet biopsy prior to care; just show up and we will treat you as needed. Show up with out ID and we will treat you regardless. We admit everyone that needs it, why they need it isn't really an issue.

Sure, but no where near as well as we are being led to believe. So we are mandated to receive a vaccine we don't want (otherwise they wouldn't have to mandate it), that should help, sort of. It was a weak premise when it was initiated and is weakening further as time passes. First the vaccine, then a booster, then maybe another booster, then, and likely, an annual booster too. This is poor medicine to mandate on people. — Book273

I don't think your position fully appreciates the nature of the threat. True, we aren't being wiped out to the point of threatening civilization. However, if you wait till then you are an idiot. A global existential threat is posed by anything that can spread that quickly and attack the respiratory system. It spreads like wildfire and occasionally stops people from breathing. It's not a good combination of things to ignore; and to ignore it with a tool to stop it in hand looks like a regret waiting to emerge.

in the ER; not the pharmacy.

All you have shown is that you are not that good at maths.

If the consequence of congregating is a cold, then there is little need to slow the spread. Any rules still standing are only there to protect the unvaccinated.

Yes, by not getting vaccinated those folk are making it harder for everyone.

It’s not a cold, though, it’s SARS-CoV-2. Even the asymptomatic can spread the disease. The rules permit that a person infected with this disease can congregate with the uninfected, so long as he has his vaccination. This is because the rules are stupid.

It’s not a cold, though, it’s SARS-CoV-2. Even the asymptomatic can spread the disease. The rules permit that a person infected with this disease can congregate with the uninfected, so long as he has his vaccination. This is because the rules are stupid. — NOS4A2

What rules, where? I tested positive after a couple of vaxes and the CDC is pretty clear about the directive to not go spreading it via 7 day to 2 week q;tine.

Pro-tip: Keep a bottle of garam masala around. If you have a fever and can't smell it anymore then it may be testing time.

The rules permit that a person infected with this disease can congregate with the uninfected, — NOS4A2

No, they don't.

True, we aren't being wiped out to the point of threatening civilization. — Cheshire

The likelihood that it progresses to that level is laughable. Our response to it IS threatening civilization as we know it. Welcome to the New World Order. That means the old world order is dead, so yeah, civilization has indeed changed, for the worst from where I sit.

The likelihood that it progresses to that level is laughable. Our response to it IS threatening civilization as we know it. Welcome to the New World Order. That means the old world order is dead, so yeah, civilization has indeed changed, for the worst from where I sit. — Book273

Well, my point was that your position doesn't acknowledge the legitimacy of the threat. So, I guess we are agreeing by demonstration. I have no idea what you have in mind regarding NWO; the irony is it includes a vague threat to civilization. There's two or arguably three things that seem to wipe people out in bunches; famine, disease, and war. It's the middle one, so what are you talking about?

No, they don't.

In many places the requirement to enter an establishment is a vaccination pass, not a covid test. So how do the rules prohibit the infected from entering?

In many places the requirement to enter an establishment is a vaccination pass, not a covid test. So how do the rules prohibit the infected from entering? — NOS4A2

They don't test everyone at the door is not a rule permitting the vaccinated infected to mingle. It's bare min. attempt to reduce the odds. Confusing the two is beyond reasonable.

The federal and state vaccine mandates prohibit the unvaccinated from working or entering certain establishments. Is there such a mandate for the infected?

The federal and state vaccine mandates prohibit the unvaccinated from working or entering certain establishments. Is there such a mandate for the infected? — NOS4A2

The health code?

In many countries, states, provinces, there are mandates that require businesses to prohibit unvaccinated people from certain establishments.

famine, disease, and war. — Cheshire

Your order is incorrect, otherwise, I believe they are all coming. First plague, then famine and war. We have plague now (disease), supply chain issues and rising prices will bring famine, and the riots already occurring in various countries need only get larger to bring about war, and let's face it, it's not like people are getting more relaxed out there.

The Prime minister of New Zealand has already brought up the "New World Order", causing more than a ruffle in the press attending that conference.

Two years ago if you had been told that you would need to produce your papers and photo ID to be allowed to sit down for a dinner out, would you have believed it? Or that the government would be telling you how many family members you can have over for Christmas or birthdays? That you would have to prove you are not sick before going to work each day? OR have to wear a mask everywhere you go in a public building? Or a different set of social rules dependent on the medical choices people have made?

How is this not a new world order? The world I grew up in, and believed in, is dead. The historic image of my country is dead, having been replaced by a quasi-nazi government spewing propaganda and division among it's citizenry. The greater good has stomped our checks and balances as the Judiciary here will not hear any suit against any of the pandemic response by government. My options are: Take it, sans reach-around, Leave the country and try to find somewhere not as intent on screwing the citizenry, or revolt.

We are looking at leaving. That's where I stand. Like it, lump it or leave. Terrible options.

A sensible law - the one in place here, for example - isolates those who are infected; they are not allowed to interact with others. No idea what the law is in your part of the world, but if it permits the infected to congregate, you need better law.

Your point remains obscure. I presume that's why you changed the topic:

My point is the vaccine mandates are stupid if the vaccinated can spread the disease. The point of the mandates is to segregate the vaccinated and unvaccinated, not the infected and the uninfected.

One must isolate if they have covid-19 or are expected to have it. Except not everyone knows they have it, or they don’t want to abide by the rules. Those people can enter establishments and congregate with others, spreading the disease.