Studies showing the opposite: — Agustino
What I have claimed is either true or false i.e. it's either true or false that long-term abstinence/celibacy is -on the whole for males*- physically and psychologically unhealthy. — Baden
You give me a call when you even speak with a monk, much less live for awhile with them. — Agustino
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2868060/ <- this is study of the potential benefits of abstinence — Agustino
And those who practice chastity are obviously morally superior to those who do not as chastity is a virtue.
What makes men different to women regarding abstinence? :sYour first paper is about women. I specifically said I was talking about men — Baden
Yes, as I said it's an opinion piece they agreed to publish. I have given you different kinds of sources if you actually bothered to pay attention. I could have given you multiple of one kind if I wanted to. But I meant to show you the directions criticisms could come from."The opinions expressed here are not necessarily the opinions of the National Medical Association" — Baden
:-}The third is a minor criticism of the methodology of a study that showed some benefits of sex (so what?) — Baden
What's funny about this? You do realise that contrary to the twisted thinking you're inferring here, they're not suggesting that not having sex while they are teens will cause them not to have children out of wedlock when they are teens - that would be fucking self-evident. They're suggesting that if they don't have sex while teens, they're less likely (later on) to have children out of wedlock (when they're no longer teens)."Current scientific evidence shows that teens who abstain from sexual activity are less likely to have children out-of-wedlock." :-| — Baden
I didn't know you meant celibacy in adult men, because I don't share your views. For me there's not much to distinguish men from women with regards to celibacy, or adults from teenagers for that matter.In other words, despite obvious efforts you've turned up precisely nothing on the benefits of long term celibacy in adult men, which is the focus of my discussion with Question. — Baden
Yeah, just a playful act, you probably have it with your mother also right? >:OIt seems to be you who is obsessed with sex. I dont notice it in the streets, because its normal to me. To have sex is just a playful act to me, but it seems to be you who gives great importance to sex because you notice it everywhere and even make a topic about it on a internet forum. — Nop
And? How did you find them?Having lived in a Buddhist country for almost 10 years, I've had plenty of contact with monks. — Baden
Yeah at least I gave articles sanctified by respected medical journals not articles for stupid people from forbes. Of course, any scientist who respects himself will not jump to conclusions (unlike stupid Forbes journalists, and the quasi-scientists they quote). I hadn't actually read that Forbes article, but now that I had a look I'm utterly disgusted how, for Heaven's name, that can pass for science >:O"Future studies should address whether abstinence has a causal role in promoting healthy behaviours or whether women with a healthy lifestyle are more likely to choose abstinence." — Michael
:-}Your entire position seems to be based on what I'd say is a fallacious moral system (Christianity, I'd wager). — Michael
As I've explained, having no sex before marriage allows one to have a potentially stronger bond with their partner ceteris paribus, and therefore allows the creation of a strong family which can dominate the social milieu and thus ensure the greatest likelihood of not only your genes surviving, but actually thriving. Because it's of little use to spread your genes, if most of those are likely to fail to survive - that's an idiotic strategy. Monogamy and no sex before marriage originate in our biology - unless you take the dim-witted view of biology as all about sex. It's not all about sex, it's all about survival and reproduction (where sex is merely a part of that). But if you notice - nobody bothers to discuss this, and other criticism I've illustrated here:So given the importance of sexual behaviour in evolution, it is no surprise that it is surrounded with strong moralistic and complicated (evolved) emotions/feelings. — Emptyheady
No they suffer of a different kind of problem than your society, that much is obvious.It strikes me that a culture that drapes their women in heavy clothes to hide their sexuality and that enforces gender specific roles suffers from far greater sexual obsession than mine. — Hanover
:-d Why would I need or want converts? I am just investigating the prejudices that others have, and outlining the mechanisms by which they are enforced in the current social milieu. I think you should be worried if you call yourself a conservative and you don't see a problem with current Western society with regards to sexuality. The fact is, it's a pity - you're not even standing up for real Western values - it's folks like me who are doing that. You're standing up for an ideological virus that has infected modern culture and has run our civilization amok towards destruction (you should ponder the meaning of that 50% divorce rate, the rising out-of-wedlock birth rate, and so forth). You should read up on what the Ancients who lived in the West thought about, that virtue called chastity for example. You may then find something interesting about the real Western culture which is currently buried in this rubble of hedonism and progressivism.Has your prosthelsyzing brought you any converts? — Hanover
Around 2 weeks. It was a very nice experience, I'd go there again sometime.How long did you live with them? Details, please. — Bitter Crank
In addition, your second comment I've quoted speaks to something specific to U.S. masculinity (not that it doesn't apply elsewhere, but I prefer to limit myself to what I am at least familiar with). There are healthier forms of masculinity, of course, but the one projected upon us is one which is impossible to live up to, causes people to make poor choices and commitments, and in general is sex-centric in a way which is (so i believe, at least) unhealthy. — Moliere
In other words, despite obvious efforts you've turned up precisely nothing on the benefits of long term celibacy in adult men, which is the focus of my discussion with Question. — Baden
Why? >:O For someone like me, going there is good for spiritual regeneration, but not to stay there completely.Had the chance to stay at Mount Athos and you left, lmao. — Heister Eggcart
People having sex is a market - for condoms, for sex toys, for medication for STDs, for abortions, for contraceptives, for pornography, for dating agencies/websites, for alcohol, etc. So what you're saying isn't the complete truth, again. People having more sex = more business of all sorts - including psychotherapy, and whatever else people need because they fuck themselves up through improper actions. The more hyped up the desire for sex is - as you are hyping it up for example - the more markets exist, and the more stupidly people behave, and so the more others can earn. Having folks in the chains of lust is a good way to sell to them. If we didn't hype up people's sex-drive, we couldn't even use sex in advertising. We use it precisely because we have gotten to the point where we've destroyed morality, and have gotten most people to give in to their lusts. And so, if they give in to their lusts, they will keep buying our products. Quite simple math. If I was a rich capitalist, I wouldn't want the common people to be free of lust... that would be fucking terrible, how I would I get them to buy all sorts of shit then?Advertising is all about selling products--one of which is not sex. The sexual allure promised for the many products advertised is limited to the product. It doesn't, it shouldn't, extend to actual sex. That would defeat the whole bait & switch purpose of advertising and selling. — Bitter Crank
Not really. People who can abstain from sex and not be guided by desires are indeed in some sense "better" individuals than those who only act on instincts and desires. — Question
But they are morally better than folks who give in to their lusts. Proper relationships are a different game, we're not discussing that here. We're discussing casual sex vs celibacy. Certainly celibacy is infinitely superior from a moral point of view. Why would you hold they're not morally better? I'm actually curious, why would you say that?Better in what sense? Morally? Again, no. — Michael
But they are morally better than folks who give in to their lusts. — Agustino
We're discussing casual sex vs celibacy. Certainly celibacy is infinitely superior from a moral point of view. — Agustino
Why would you hold they're not morally better? I'm actually curious, why would you say that? — Agustino
So are you, or are you not able to give a reason why you hold your position? In the former case, I'd like to hear it. In the latter case, then I'll ask you to agree that as you have no reason for holding it, to do so is irrational.You might as well ask why I don't think that eating apples is morally superior to eating oranges. To claim that it is is completely unjustified, as is the claim that celibacy is morally superior to casual sex. — Michael
So are you, or are you not able to give a reason why you hold your position? In the former case, I'd like to hear it. In the latter case, then I'll ask you to agree that as you have no reason for holding it, to do so is irrational.
It seems that all you can do to refute my statements is to say no. That ain't good enough mate. — Agustino
Okay so the reason is simply that you don't know, so you're afraid to say it is so for fear of making a mistake, when you don't in fact know what the case is. If this is so, why are you saying my statement is false, instead of asking me what reasons I have for holding it as true?I've given you the reason. I have no reasons to believe that celibacy is morally superior to casual sex. — Michael
If this is so, why are you saying my statement is false — Agustino
Instead of asking me what reasons I have for holding it as true?
Ah so you do have knowledge about it. Why do you think it is false? Not having reasons to believe it isn't sufficient to hold that it is positively false. So what are your reasons for holding it is false?Because it is false. — Michael
How is this possible granted that I became a social conservative before I became a Christian?I'm guessing it has something to do with your Christian faith. Either that or, based on some of the things you've said before, a naturalistic fallacy. — Michael
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