Metaphysical will causes you to make the choices, no? Please share your thoughts. — 3017amen
Let's nail this down. 3017amen agrees that God does not exist in any material way or sense, but rather that the existence of g/God(s) is as ideas and is a function of and depends entirely and solely on the minds that think them. Can we be clear on this?God means different things to different people, including myself. Right now I'm focusing on the metaphysical aspects relative to consciousness viz Jesus. — 3017amen
There's one factor that ought to be considered, however - which is that from the non-believer's perspective, there can be no real merit beyond the social, cultural and personal domain. There's nothing at stake beyond that. Whereas from the religious perspective there really is something at stake - something of ultimate importance. So there's an asymmetry there. — Wayfarer
use the word cause as a kind of black box. But that won't do. You shall have to open the box and start to try to understand the word - and it's not a simple word. — tim wood
Let's nail this down. 3017amen agrees that God does not exist in any material way or sense, but rather that the existence of g/God(s) is as ideas and is a function of and depends entirely and solely on the minds that think them. Can we be clear on this? — tim wood
And you keep throwing the word "metaphysical." The more thrown, the more I'm persuaded you don't know what it means. I have a definition - not mine - that metaphysics is the study of the presuppositions and absolute presuppositions made by different people at different times. Is that yours also? — tim wood
(Very roughly) The problem was, where is the natural world? If in the mind, a construction of the mind, then how do we know anything about "out there"? If on the other hand the natural world is just what we perceive as we perceive it, then how do we know anything about it, not being able to observe or perceive knowledge, and at best being only able to catalog coincidence?synthetic a priori knowledge. — 3017amen
If you aver Jesus was (a) god. then evidence. And hearsay rules apply; hearsay is not evidence.On the contrary Jesus was a man. — 3017amen
English, please. This is incoherent.What would you call the metaphysical phenomena it causes you to live or die? — 3017amen
you aver Jesus was (a) god. then evidence. And hearsay rules apply; hearsay is not evidence. — tim wood
For the rest, it's appearing that you do not know how, or are not interested, in a real discussion. Recall I said I'm not playing. Start making sense, or quit. — tim wood
I believe Jesus was recorded in history much like George Washington Albert Einstein — 3017amen
Arent you essentially reinforcing Wayfarers point there? To a believer, you have your priorities out of order in not putting god or the afterlife before worldly concerns. — DingoJones
Imponderable. Unanswerable. — tim wood
... are a minuscule concern next to immortal soul and gods higher purpose.
You may not agree, but its fallacious to use different premises (there is no god or afterlife, all that stuff is bullshit) to justify the rejection of a conclusion based on different premises (there is a god and afterlife). Obviously if you dont believe you arent going to think any if that is more important than mortal concerns (which are the only concerns a non-believer has). — DingoJones
Most believers arent like that though, many a christian will genuinely feel its of utmost importance to prioritise everyones soul, and that everyone is better off putting god first. — DingoJones
I'm sure many Christians also pray for an end to global warming, an end to mass extinction, an end to injustice, etc. These would be obvious things to pray for, and go beyond personal salvation. — Kenosha Kid
Is there anything that you know of that Christians pray for that is more important than their personal salvation and is more important than the biggest problems facing secular society — Kenosha Kid
What things do you pray for that are of more importance than the comparatively petty "social, cultural and personal" considerations I've suggested? — Kenosha Kid
So how do you know what most Christians pray for? — Kenosha Kid
I'm not hearing anything that justifies the claim that, even from a believer's point of view, puts believer's concerns somehow ahead of the secular world. Even the salvation of everyone is a secular concern, and I'm confident that secular means will be the means by which it is done, if it is done. — Kenosha Kid
Btw, the existence of the man Jesus is granted. Do you say he is just a man? Or something else? — tim wood
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