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It's odd, that claiming not to be able to think about things is now so popular a way of thinking about things.

Without the intellectuals we would still be apes. — ZzzoneiroCosm

Strictly speaking we are apes. It's the intellectual who wants to forget that.

Also the notion of the intellectual in the Nietzschean sense is far cry from the contemporary notion.

"It is the intellect that saves us from being utterly burnt and reduced to ashes..."


(Wish I knew my Nietzsche better. Maybe someone knows a more apropos quote.)

Strictly speaking we are apes. — frank

Strictly speaking we are absolutely not apes. We are human.

Always bears repeating:

"What is the ape to man? A laughing-stock, a thing of shame. And just the same shall man be to the Superman: a laughing-stock, a thing of shame. Ye have made your way from the worm to man, and much within you is still worm....Lo, I teach you the Superman!

The Superman is the meaning of the earth. Let your will say: The Superman SHALL BE the meaning of the earth!"




Who has not fallen short of the glory of god.

Hominidae

Strictly speaking we are absolutely not apes. We are human. — ZzzoneiroCosm

We are smart apes, but apes, and being a smart ape is a major piece of our existential problem.

There are exceptions, of course. Some humans are dumb apes, like the current POTUS. Therefore, DUMP TRUMP IN NOVEMBER!

What is the ape to man? A laughing-stock, a thing of shame. And just the same shall man be to the Superman: a laughing-stock, a thing of shame. Ye have made your way from the worm to man, and much within you is still worm....Lo, I teach you the Superman!

The Superman is the meaning of the earth. Let your will say: The Superman SHALL BE the meaning of the earth!" — ZzzoneiroCosm

What does this mean to you?

We are smart apes, but apes, and being a smart ape is a major piece of our existential problem. — Bitter Crank

We actually aren't apes. Our ancestors were apes.

You might as well say we're a single cell. Or pre-gelid cosmic dust. Or a singularity. Why stop at ape.

We're great apes.

It inspires me to continue to become larger than I am. In incites me to continue to master the arts of peace, intellect, wisdom and glory. It's a question of human dignity.


As to what it means: Poetry is open to interpretation. I'm certain I've had the very experience that incited Nietzsche to write those lines. (Not to say I have a speck of his intellect.)

cool

We actually aren't apes. — ZzzoneiroCosm

The Hominidae (/hɒˈmɪnɪdiː/), whose members are known as great apes[note 1] or hominids (/ˈhɒmɪnɪdz/), are a taxonomic family of primates that includes eight extant species in four genera: Pongo, the Bornean, Sumatran and Tapanuli orangutan; Gorilla, the eastern and western gorilla; Pan, the common chimpanzee and the bonobo; and Homo, of which only modern humans remain.[1]

Wiki.

Well, what have you got against apes? All apes are primates. Humans are primates. Therefore, humans are apes. Something like that. Apes are a distinguished species.

We have only 1.2 percent genetic difference between modern humans and chimpanzees. Granted, that 1.2% makes a significant difference. I don't think chimps have a hyoid bone, a piece of bone located in the human throat which is a critical part of speech production. Still, we are a lot like chimps in many ways. (Intellect isn't the only thing significant about our (plural) species.)

Does the fox object to being related to the wolf? Does the family dog object to being related to both fox and wolf?

We actually aren't apes. Our ancestors were apes. — ZzzoneiroCosm

So, at what point did we leave the company of primates?

So, at what point did we leave the company of primates? — Bitter Crank

That isn't known, to my knowledge. What's known is we are no longer apes. To call us apes is to say something untrue.

The Hominidae (/hɒˈmɪnɪdiː/), whose members are known as great apes[note 1] or hominids (/ˈhɒmɪnɪdz/), are a taxonomic family of primates that includes eight extant species in four genera: Pongo, the Bornean, Sumatran and Tapanuli orangutan; Gorilla, the eastern and western gorilla; Pan, the common chimpanzee and the bonobo; and Homo, of which only modern humans remain.

Science draws funny lines. Science doesn't draw the only lines.

It's easy to argue humans aren't apes. The jury would not be hung.

It's an imprecise use of language and we should not be comfortable with it.

Well, what have you got against apes? — Bitter Crank

I laugh at apes. They're a laughing-stock.

A joke set beside the sublimity of man.

Nietzsche — ZzzoneiroCosm

apes — ZzzoneiroCosm

intellect — ZzzoneiroCosm

Intellect isn't all or nothing. Even clams have enough sense to shut up and get out of town when trouble comes their way, (Octopi and squid are both in the same group as clams, and have quite a bit of brain power. A dog has much more brain power than a squid, but a Dalmatian can't change its spots. A squid can. A bonobo or pan troglodytes (Chimps official name) have a lot more brain power than dogs, and have a brain structure similar to ours. Bees are much different than squid, dogs, chimps, and you -- but bees too have some brain power.

That we are closely related to apes should be a matter of delight. Why? Because they are kin. They aren't our ancestors (we branched off from the stalk of the family, as they also did, millions of years ago. Well, about 8 million years ago,

We have a lot in common with other apes. They just cant talk.

Today our illustrious leader proposed the following remedies:

“Supposing we hit the body with a tremendous ultra violet or just very powerful light. And I think you said that hasn’t been checked but you are going to test it. And then I said supposing you brought the light inside the body, which you could do either through the skin or in some other way. I think you said that you are going to test that, too. And then I saw the disinfectant, where knocks it out in one minute, and is there a way we could do something like that by injection inside or almost a cleaning. As you see it gets in the lungs, it does a tremendous number on the lungs, so it would be interesting to check that.”

Is it wrong of me to wish he would try these things on himself?

That we are closely related to apes should be a matter of delight. — Bitter Crank

I agree we are closely related. Too closely. I hope we become less and less closely related to the apes.

To look back on the ape as today we look back on the single cell.

I hear what you're saying. A couple anthropology professors I've spoken with have told me that although the term "ape" technically includes homo sapiens, they don't often use the term as such -- even among their colleagues -- as the term has come to connote something different in ordinary non-scientific discourse. Usually what I'll hear is, "Humans and apes share a common ancestor," but 'ape' here just means non-human hominoids. In any case, I suspect this is a semantic disagreement.

I hear what you're saying. A couple anthropology professors I've spoken with have told me that although the term "ape" technically includes homo sapiens, they don't often use the term as such -- even among their colleagues -- as the term has come to connote something different in ordinary non-scientific discourse. Usually what I'll hear is, "Humans and apes share a common ancestor," but 'ape' here just means non-human hominoids. In any case, I suspect this is a semantic disagreement — Wolfman

Thanks.

It's a disagreement over connotation. No one is right or wrong. It feels powerful and righteous to say I am not an ape, I am human.

I laugh at apes. They're a laughing-stock. — ZzzoneiroCosm

You think you have the same relationship to apes that the gods have to us? a joke...

How do you make the gods laugh?
Tell them your plans.

If we're so smart, how come we don't seem to be able to do anything about the reality that we are wrecking the environment.

I hope we become less and less closely related to the apes. — ZzzoneiroCosm

In the fullness of time (which we probably don't have, being too stupid as we are to solve our problems) we will become less and less like primates, We'll probably get a bit lighter in build, and maybe--dear god, may it be--smarter. But this will take a long time--many, many generations.

And we will probably wipe ourselves out before we get many, many generations to evolve into something closer to the paragon of animals that Shakespeare thought we were.

I don't see why this is some kind of either-or. Anyone can see the almost the entirity of the US ruling class - from Cuomo who closed schools way, way, way too late, to Las Vagas' mayor who recently offered to kill her poor just to see what happens, to Trump, whose shitfuckery needs no introduction - is utterly shit and that the US is just a terrible place and everything about it sucks and is devised to kill its citizens. I think this is a fair compromise.

And of course Larry Summers, who helped Obama devise the last criminal bailout of the rich while leaving the poor to burn, is advising Biden on CV recovery. God, everything about your leaders is just total trash.

Oh yes and I forgot about the shithead governer of some buttfuck state somewhere the other day, who, on TV in a mask, gloves, and full, gleaming blue protective gear, told his state that reopening is totally safe and everything is fine. There's no debate here: US leadership is uniformly terrible, and it is led by someone whose incompetence is the mutiplictive product of all of them.

But this will take a long time--many, many generations. — Bitter Crank

It will teach us patience.

If we're so smart, — Bitter Crank

I never said we're smart. We're dumb.

I said we are beautiful in the mode of the sublime.

"A joke set beside the sublimity of man."

You think you have the same relationship to apes that the gods have to us? — Bitter Crank

You said god. I didn't say god.

I have the same relationship to my apy ancestors that I have to the single cell. Again: Why stop at ape? Why not say we're fish or ooze?