If we were to try and identify these "perturbations" in the lives of the unfortunate poor, the most common would be diseases and these diseases, by and large, are untreated because the poor can't afford them, eventually leading to death. — TheMadFool

I'm thinknig of the poor in WEstern nations who yes have to deal with diseases, but they also have to deal with the stress of making ends meet, of living in dangerous neighborhoods, of the dangers for their children (crime, drug use, violence, pregnancy, not doing well in school, and so on) I don't know where you got your idea that the main stress for the poor is diseases, but I guess I would need to see some documentation of that. Also why you think the articles I linked to are not correct.

If your people's ideas of success is to have a government that imposes poverty, then your country is not living in in best moral way. Neither would mine. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

I don't think you understand what I'm getting at.

Where I live, it is practically unthinkable that people would starve to death or freeze, or not be treated during an emergency. Yet, people are still stressed out about so called 'poverty'.

Why is that?

Because it is not really poverty most people are worried about. It is losing the wealth they currently own, or not being able to acquire the wealth that they would like to own, or living up to society's/their environment's expectations of them.

Where I live, it is practically unthinkable that people would starve to death or freeze, — Tzeentch

Here in Canada as well, yet too many die on the streets and in their cars every year, be it from heat or cold.

Where do you live?

Yet, people are still stressed out about so called 'poverty'.

Why is that? — Tzeentch

Because they are poor and the human animal is born the weakest and most insecure animal on the planet.

Regards
DL

You do know you are an American. Would North American be better? — ssu

If I ignore my political and geographical location, I am an Earthman on spaceship Earth.

As a Gnostic Christian, I am a universalist and since we are all pollution each other's environment, I think the world should start thinking the same sane way and stop thinking of their little tribe as important and join the human tribe.

That is how you love all of your neighbors

Ownership and having influence over decisions are two different things. — ssu

Pfffft.

The owner who is paying the bill and buying off the guy you voted for almost always gets his way.

Regards
DL

it's not stress but disease, — TheMadFool

Stress lowers the immune system and allows those diseases you have in mind to nail the poor harder than the rest of us who are better fed and housed and who can pay for medical services.

I think that link speaks of the various conditions that target the most stressed.

Regards
DL

I am an Earthman on spaceship Earth. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

A modern Canadian, I see.

Stress lowers the immune system and allows those diseases you have in mind to nail the poor harder than the rest of us who are better fed and housed and who can pay for medical services.

I think that link speaks of the various conditions that target the most stressed. — Gnostic Christian Bishop

Good point!

You're putting the cart before the horse. Stress is a response i.e. it doesn't arise spontaneously without a cause. It can be said that poverty itself is the cause for stress but that would mean you'd have to acknowledge the chain of causation: poverty -> stress -> weak immune system -> disease -> death. Doesn't that compel you to say that poverty itself, instead of stress, is the cause of death of the poor?

Think of it; anger is a reaction and always has a cause unless you have a psychiatric illness or are the incredible Hulk. Imagine now that someone insults you and makes you angry; you lash out and sock that someone in the face. If this goes to court, the causal chain in your case will begin not from the point you got angry because anger being only a reaction, there must be a cause for it, but at the true starting point of the causal chain, the insult hurled at you. Likewise, although stress can be a cause, it's always an intermediate cause and arises in response to something that precedes it, in this case poverty; ergo, poverty is the true cause of death by inducing stress that weakens the immune system and makes them prone to disease.

I'm thinknig of the poor in WEstern nations who yes have to deal with diseases, but they also have to deal with the stress of making ends meet, of living in dangerous neighborhoods, of the dangers for their children (crime, drug use, violence, pregnancy, not doing well in school, and so on) I don't know where you got your idea that the main stress for the poor is diseases, but I guess I would need to see some documentation of that. Also why you think the articles I linked to are not correct. — Coben

I agree. :up:

A modern Canadian, I see. — ssu

More of a redneck with a working brain.

Although some are telling me that I am starting to express myself like an educated person, even with my French influenced grammar.

I guess I can fool some people some of the time.

Regards
DL

Stress is a response i.e. it doesn't arise spontaneously without a cause — TheMadFool

I have already agreed on this and pointed to the government imposing poverty as the trigger to the stress they cause in the poor. I include the lower middle classes in my critique.

Regards
DL

Does being in a good lot bring happiness and joy for life?

Why would the opposite not produce the opposite, which would be synonymous with stress? — Gnostic Christian Bishop

Stress is only ONE of the bad things. Not all bad things are stress.

This is another concept of set theory; that some of the bad things are stress, and some of the bad things are not stress. Being opposite to good is bad, but being opposite to good is not always stress, only some of the time.

Stress is only ONE of the bad things. Not all bad things are stress.

This is another concept of set theory; that some of the bad things are stress, and some of the bad things are not stress. Being opposite to good is bad, but being opposite to good is not always stress, only some of the time. — god must be atheist

You make weird analogy that I can't agree with.

Good goes with evil, not stress.

Bad goes with good, not stress.

You seem to think that stress can be a good thing. Give an example or two please, of good stress.

From the definition.

2. a state of mental or emotional strain or tension resulting from adverse or very demanding circumstances.

I can give you that competitive stress --- might --- help a runner of swimmer reach a certain mind set, but if that stress actually helps his performance, IDK.

Is that what you were thinking with your view that stress can be good? If so, do you have performance stats to show the good?

Regards
DL

I am sorry. I did not know you were this incomprehensibly stupid. I apologize.

I had some vague memories from our days in Philosophy Now that you were from time to time totally whacky. But not all the time. I just caught you in a bad moment, I guess.

Again, I apologize.

Ditto, a hole sore loser..

Regard
DL

:up:

I may have made an error. Any way thanks for the :up: even if undeserved. Makes it twice as valuable :smile:

Well, I feel like you may have experienced me as pettily critical, so I went for 'cool, we agree'. :smile:

:ok: