So the idea that science 'reveals' a universe that exists or would exist just as if there was nobody observing it, is a falsehood in its own right. — Wayfarer
Let's assume for the sake of argument that some kind of creative intelligence is responsible for big bang. — jellyfish
Vaccum is a term used in science for pragmatic purposes. We are talking metaphysics here not science. Same way mathematicians play with the term zero, even though it only exists in the mind. — OmniscientNihilist
Yes, indeed the metaphysical nothing is not to be confused with the physicist's nothing. In your court now: please define your nothing. (See if you can get around the no-thing (gerund, from v. "to noth") of the nothing (noun?).) — timw
I contend that the 'fine tuning' argument undermines this view, because in order for there to be atoms, there first had to be stars - so the causal chain that created the circumstances for life had to start before there was even matter; so, not an accident, not meaningfully the outcome of chance. — Wayfarer
something eternal and omnipresent, which is here now, that I AM. — OmniscientNihilist
So, it is at least an 'it', but not necessarily an 'I' of mind. — PoeticUniverse
And anything that currently actually exists must necessarily be eternal, and omnipresent. — OmniscientNihilist
I am more interested herein in explaining the one and only 'it' — PoeticUniverse
explaining the 'it' — OmniscientNihilist
look within and there it is. here it is. it is you. i am it. — OmniscientNihilist
It's merely the outline of the TOE — PoeticUniverse
The mind can never have omniscience, it comes from directly from consciousness to consciousness. — OmniscientNihilist
Bypass both and look directly with consciousness. and know yourself omnisciently. — OmniscientNihilist
For is consciousness can come from a brain, then why can't water suddenly stand up and talk? — Gregory
To say concousness cannot be caused by brains because it cannot come from nothing is incoherent. Brains aren't nothing. — TheWillowOfDarkness
There is no cause which is nothing. The entire point of giving any causal account is that something is involved in producing something else--i.e. to claim a causality is to assert something came for something else. — TheWillowOfDarkness
two totally different substsances — OmniscientNihilist
to claim a causality is to assert something came for something else. — TheWillowOfDarkness
Not a worry here, since conscious instances are just another state of matter. — TheWillowOfDarkness
Sometimes we get diamonds, other times we get states of conscious experience. — TheWillowOfDarkness
Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break in and steal. But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break in nor steal.
Let's look at what it means for "something" to come from "nothing". — petrichor
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