12
Possibly everyone knows the novel which was written by Ivan Sergeevich Turgenev "Fathers and Children" and if not, everybody must know a philosophical current called nihilism. So, is nihilism the right perception of the world, or an excuse for the lack of talent the person? — Artie

Yes, I know that book. I think you might want to specify more what you mean by 'nihilism.' Weren't some of them political idealists who risked their lives in acts of terrorism and crime?

But beyond that I do not think it is a good approach to equate nihilism with lack of talent. There is only a small step from nihilism to a radical open-mindedness that can potentially revolutionize our ways of thinking. Moreover nihilism is usually the 'output' of a mind that thinks at a high level of abstraction. Such a mind has already gathered the world up as a system and decided that none of those in authority have 'absolute' or 'real' or 'true' authority. I grant that getting stuck here (repeating and dwelling on this idea as the height of all thinking and not continuing the dialectic) might indicate a lack of talent.

I have been through a 'nihilist' phase, and I even still think nihilism captures something important about our human situation, even if it wildly ignores other aspects. The point, as I see it, is to keep moving, keep thinking, keep clarifying one's existence. And this is something the nihilist misses, that his own nihilism is the result of a process that seeks to grasp itself. And of course the nihilist (especially if he bothers to share and defend his position) finds value in his supposed nihilism. As he realizes this, his position will evolve to account for its own possibility. I consider this a Hegelian idea. A description of 'what is' (Reality) that does not account for itself and its own possibility must therefore be a partial description. I personally don't think an exhaustive description of what-is or what-is-for-us-and-not-just-me is possible, but I do think thought has a 'natural' movement toward a more comprehensive and joyful description --which is not to say that it can't get stuck.

nihilism cancels itself out into a value system as no moral code as correct observes morality as evil. Morality is a way of being and inevitable.

Interesting points, nihilism reflects a dark night of the soul in many respects.

Interesting points, nihilism reflects a dark night of the soul in many respects. — eodnhoj7

Exactly.

Nihilism is the exact opposite of Mind. It is a proposition. It is not a proof.

nihilism reflects a dark night of the soul in many respects. — eodnhoj7

But with no light at the end of the tunnel.

Excuse me, will you can describe you point of view in detail?

By Nihilism, I assume you mean the view that "All things have no Purpose" or "All things have no Intrinsic Value".

Nihilism bring a good concept by saying "The things that happen now in our live, is not designed to be like this, it even doesn't have any natural design at all". That's mean there are no Transcendental purpose in Moral Law, Lives, or Tradition.

Now the problem of Nihilism is the view doesn't give the response of what should we do AFTER we realized that there are no purpose in our life or moral law. This lead people to depression, anarchy and self-exalting authority. Nihilism believe we are basically Fuc*ed because there are no light in the tunnel. That's why Existentialist rise up. Existentialist believe because we don't have a Transcendental purpose in life, this bring us Freedom to choose what life purpose is. That lead to people now searching for meaning of life, and we know that "Purpose" and "Value" bring happiness (or happiness is sometimes the purpose itself, according to some people).

That's why, the nihilistic people may seem the most depressing and lazy, because they don't have a purpose, and stuck in bondage of non-purposeful life.

That's why, the nihilistic people may seem the most depressing and lazy, because they don't have a purpose, and stuck in bondage of non-purposeful life. — diesynyang

How do you think that leads the people to nihilism? And do you support this ideology?

Depression and lazyness doesn't excatly lead to Nihilism, But Nihilism lead to Depression and lazyness
: D

Nihilism start when people believe that God is not real. Now because there are no God, there is no purpose in "All Life" and rules are made to persevere that "Life". If Life has no purpose, then we basically don't have any assurance, any indication between right or wrong, nothing.

I don't support this ideology because of the reason in my previous post, BUT it will do us good to learn about it : D

Depression and lazyness doesn't excatly lead to Nihilism — diesynyang

Why depression and laziness doesn't lead to Nihilism? Maybe the people so justify themselves and
their laziness?

Now because there are no God, there is no purpose in "All Life" and rules are made to persevere that "Life". If Life has no purpose, then we basically don't have any assurance, any indication between right or wrong, nothing. — diesynyang

Or you realize that things like purpose and moral judgments are things that individual persons do. That doesn't amount to there being no purpose(s) or moral judgments.

Nihilism is a popular concept in Buddhism and Hinduism.

In Philosophy it is the opposite view of the Mind.

You can google "the mind in philosophy" or you can read Roger Scruton's book on Modern Philosophy and the chapter on Mind.

Hmm I don't say it CAN'T lead to nihilism, it indeed can. BUT not all nihilism start with lazyness and depression.

You should now that some Nihilist maybe once the most hardworking person in his job, BUT precisely because of the tiresome of those hard work, they start to question "What is the purpose/value of my hard job excatly?" And thus lead to nihilist answer.



Agree

Do you know it the saying: "Started for health, and finished for the rest" I maybe translated it incorrect but the meaning left. I tell you don't about the life purpose, I tell you that nihilists not recognize art on the whole.

Sorry, could you write it ummm better, I couldn't understand

I tell you that nihilists not recognize art on the whole. Sorry, I'm not
native speaker.

Oh! You're talking about Art! Yes Art is "Useless" to nihilist because they don't have any transcendal purpose or inherent meaning

Ps. I'm not a native speaker too :D

Wait, I'm a nihilist in the sense that I don't believe there is any objective morality, meaning, value, etc.--no facts about that stuff beyond facts about how particular individuals think, yet I love art in all its guises--not just visual art, and it's even what I do for a living.

I don't at all believe that there is such a thing as "transcendental purpose" or "inherent meaning." And I think the fact that there are no such things is irrelevant to art.

If someone asked you,

Why bother doing art? Only few people see it. And in the end they will die, your works will also be forgotten and destroyed. You just spend the time you has doing something insignificant that is not eternal. Why bother doing art in the first place. Even if it makes you happy, in the end those happiness will also be sweep away by sadness. Art has no value then

What are your response? :D

If someone asked you,

Why bother doing art? Only few people see it. And in the end they will die, your works will also be forgotten and destroyed. You just spend the time you has doing something insignificant that is not eternal. Why bother doing art in the first place. Even if it makes you happy, in the end those happiness will also be sweep away by sadness. Art has no value then — diesynyang

If someone asked in that way I'd ask them why something has to be eternal to be worthwhile in their view. That seems like a very odd disposition that has little to do with what valuing anything is ontologically.

If it not eternality, then what makes "Something" worthwhile? :D

If it not eternality, then what makes "Something" worthwhile? — diesynyang

Whatever a particular individual values is what makes anything worthwhile. If we identify where valuing takes place, identify what it is, we realize that it's just individual persons' feeling positive feelings towards something, caring about it, enjoying it, etc.

You love art because it makes you happy. Because Art doesn't have any transcedental value or purpose, we as human can put value or purpose all we like, that is how an Existentialist think, It has value to you.

A nihilist (in its extreme form) don't believe that, the moment you "Believe" you have found the Value of something, you stopped being a Nihilist. You just become An Atheist Existentialist : D

If you know the story of Syshypus (The king who cheated death and punish to spend all eternity rolling stone to the top of the hill only to see it falling again, and doing it all over again)

Albert Camu (or Jean Paul Satre, forgot) once said "One can Imagine that syshypus is the happiest, most purposefull person in the world"

A nihilist (in its extreme form) don't believe that, the moment you "Believe" you have found the Value of something, you stopped being a Nihilist. — diesynyang

There's a popular sense of "nihilism," which is found in most dictionaries, where it refers to a belief that there is no objective/factual value, meaning, etc. That's the sense in which I'm a nihilist (which isn't a term I normally use, but it comes up often enough online via threads like this)

You all complicate everything, and miss the entire point of everything else. Nietzsche would have found the original post in this to be ridiculous. The disintegration of morality and purpose which was once provided by the church, is all but gone. With the disappearance of these two things, and through an inability to recapture them through the construction of oneself. We become prone to the philosophy that " nothing matters " in a sense that, our actions come to have no purpose, and the effects caused by them are of no real consequence. On top of that, the search for both morality which governs man whether, and purpose, are two inherent searches which all humans seek. Nietzsche knew that 99% of individuals cant think for themselves, and was trying very hard to warn us that after these aspects disappeared, that a hole would become available to be filled. If we did not fill it, it would be filled in by others.

Nihilism is armageddon.

^Excatly, that's why when someone said "I'm a nihilist" they usually is not a nihilist. Because a true nihilist is a broken person

I think is lack of talent.

But with no light at the end of the tunnel. — Wayfarer

Indeed, that is how nihilism experiences itself and what makes it a dark night of the soul. The self is thrown back on its own existence. It is beyond the usual platitudes. It no longer takes 'spiritual' truths on authority. Only now can it work out its own salvation with fear and trembling. Only now is it facing the problem first-person and not just nodding along with the experts who keep it from the depths of its personal situation. The other cannot die for me, and the other cannot find 'God' for me.