Existential nihilism gives you the freedom to shape meaning how you like; it, however, does not remove it. It is the realization that in an existence devoid of intrinsic value we are free to define and shape our own paths. I have never understood why people see this a negative thing. It means we are free and that our future truly belongs to us.

no you are not. subjective =/= objective. They are polar opposites.

I am starting to think that you like the idea of nihilism, but that you don't really understand it. — Jeremiah

Would you enlighten me then? What am I getting wrong

If your world is so easily shaped by words, then you are not much of a nihilist. — Jeremiah

And what does that even mean. That just sounds like word salad

We don't shape meaning rather we are shaped by meaning. Meaning is not something anyone ever subjectively decides. This is delusional statement that completely misses what meaning is.

I understand that. However existential nihilism staunchly stands against OBJECTIVE meaning which is what my whole argument is about. Objective as in self evident to all and impossible to disagree with. I am starting to think you don't understand what I am saying

Nihilism never stands "staunchly" against anything. That would imply a purpose, a meaning and a direction.

You want that to be true and that is why you selected those modifiers. In a world without meaning, there is no reason at all for why you can't find "objective meaning" in just about anything you want. There is nothing stopping you, and you don't need to justify it as the universe doesn't care.

Not interested.

There is no logic for existence, and so, there can be no logic for nihilistic relativism.

you don't value truth

The fact that there is no logic for existence IS the main point of nihilistic relativism. Nihilistic relativism is a recognition of that fact and the relativism it entails

Nihilism stands staunchly against an objective meaning or purpose for living. That's not a value judgement that's a lack of one. Those are not the same thing. I am starting to think YOU don't understand nihilism

The world is meaning. Emphasis placed upon the is here. Without meaning there is no world.

It can not only not be the main point of nihilism, there can be no point for nihilism to be objectified for an object needs a subject, and nihilism has none.

for an object needs a subject, and nihilism has none. — jufa

please elaborate

For example, "I see a green apple" requires the premise "Visual perception is reliable" for it to be considered true. — khaled

Imagine if you were diagnosed with a dreadful illness, which you were told was going to result in your dying a very painful death whilst undergoing terrible disfigurement. I mean, really imagine it - not simply laugh it off, 'well that's not going to happen', because it actually does happen. Then, you are told, there is a cure that is recently developed which has proven very effective against this condition, and there's a very good chance it will cure it outright.

Would you say that it doesn't make any difference whether or not that statement about the cure is true?

Not the "truth" you are peddling.

Well good luck with your thinking, you are going to need it.

I Does nihilism have an objective meaning?

It is self-explanatory, but since you don't want to acknowledge what I 'm saying, let's regress to a lower stage. A noun needs an adjective to have an active life. That is saying if the noun can never clarify its meaning, it is as the salt in the dead sea. The adjective is therefore noun's substance for it gives the noun size, shape, age, color, origin or material. What is the adjective for nihilism? Please elaborate!

Not interested. — Jeremiah

Not the "truth" you are peddling. — Jeremiah

Well good luck with your thinking, you are going to need it. — Jeremiah

Do you end all of your discussions with uncooperative one liners

I don't know what you mean by "adjective of nihilism". I can tell you the meaning of nihilism though: There is no objective morality/knowledge/value. It is the belief that an objective belief is impossible

I can tell you the meaning of nihilism though: There is no objective morality/knowledge/value. It is the belief that an objective belief is impossible — khaled

I think I would qualify as a nihilist. I don't think it's necessary to use words like objective/subjective though. I'm never quite sure what people mean by "objective" anyway. In my view, to believe that morality/knowledge/value are culturally determined or socially constructed is different to saying that they are subjective and not objective. I believe in the former not the latter.

Come on khaled, stop playing the 'I don't know what you mean game', you know the deal. Thank you for the conversation, I take my leave at this point.

Hey can we take a vote on who actually understands this guy? cuz I don't. If anyone can explain what he's saying I'd be glad to hear

oh sorry forgot to reply to you. It makes a difference only because I decided it would and my decision it would is arbitrary. Imagine if I was suicidal. Or a masochist for example. Had I been one of those then it wouldn't have mattered but I just happen to be a healthy human being. I think you're mistaking objective for subjective meaning. It is my subjective opinion that the truth of that statement should matter but it is not an infallable law for everyone. Nihilism only opposes objective meaning (self evident/impossible to disagree with) but says nothing about subjective meaning. I don't understand why people assume I personally don't adhere to a morality or a system of knowledge. The statement was OBJECTIVE knowledge is impossible. My adherence to this system or that has nothing to do with the truth value of that statement. It's the same as when most people assume that hard determinists are animalistic hedonists when that is never stated or implied.

Why do you care?

I don't. However it might signal to other users that you do not tend to finish conversations which is useful information. Why do I care about informing other users? No reason but why not?

I like how you try so hard to pretend like you don't care. Got to keep up that nihilistic image, right? Or how you think they should act, rather.

Ok sure you got me I care. How does that invalidate the claim that an objective morality/value/knowledge is impossible in any way. My subjective value has to impact on that statement whatsoever

bjective morality/value is impossible — khaled

I don't remember you actually establishing that. Perhaps you should actually try.

I assumed everyone is familiar with some of the justifications of nihilistic relativism but here is my own formulation of it
P1: The application of logic requires premises
P2: Any conclusion the application of logic leads to is true if the premises are true
P3: There is no way for a premise to be determined true or false except relative to another premise
(ex: in order to refute the premise "all humans are green" one must accept the premise "visual perception is more reliable than this idiot" and the premise "I don't see green humans")
P4: A premise cannot determine it's own truth value (follows from P3)
P5: There is an infinite number of potential premises that can be used in an argument
P6: Consequently there is an infinite number of potential premises that can be used to determine the truth value of a premise
C: Every premise is true if the right premises are used to determine it's truth value
C: Every conclusion is valid if the right premises are used to determine it's truth value

Or at least that's the knowledge part of objective knowledge/morality/value but that one suffices for the other two