Common BC, we both know that those aren't the skills needed to become a billionaire. We both know that most often people become billionaires by starting a business and making lots of sales. Habits of middle-class parents aren't needed; neither is an education if by that you mean what you get in school (or 'top universities' for that matter). 33% of all billionaires are dropouts. Many of the rich people I've met are quite uneducated.You are right that billionaires are made, not born. You are wrong that the doors to fabulous wealth are wide open. There are certain entry level requirements that working people (most of the population) lack: the habits of middle class parents; a solid education starting in primary school and ending in one of the top ranked universities; contacts among successful, wealthy people; access to investment capital, and so on. — Bitter Crank
It's the achievement of your goals generally, which would include some degree of wealth, but it would more likely include security, freedom, upward mobility, and greater happiness generally. I'd imagine it's subjective and variable from person to person. If you're currently living the life you desire (more or less), I'd call you successful, even if not wealthy. — Hanover
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
“The American Dream is that dream of a land in which life should be better and richer and fuller for everyone, with opportunity for each according to ability or achievement. It is a difficult dream for the European upper classes to interpret adequately, and too many of us ourselves have grown weary and mistrustful of it. It is not a dream of motor cars and high wages merely, but a dream of social order in which each man and each woman shall be able to attain to the fullest stature of which they are innately capable, and be recognized by others for what they are, regardless of the fortuitous circumstances of birth or position.”
Many of the rich people I've met are quite uneducated. — Agustino
having the right political connections — Agustino
Making sales. — Agustino
I don't give a fuck if it makes you yawn. I'm not here for your entertainment. — Pseudonym
So America offers immigrants a slightly better deal than they get in the countries that Western trading policies trashed in the first place. Well done them. — Pseudonym
And yet, you told me that lack of education is what keeps some from being rich?I'm not surprised. The "If you're so rich, how come you're so stupid?" phenomenon. — Bitter Crank
Yes, the political aspect is definitely true. Class connections? Not really. In the more corrupt places, it is access to the relevant decision makers. Who knows how you get that? Maybe you went to school with them - several of Putin's friends are now billionaires for example.Political and class connections has been shown to be a part of gaining access to capital, expertise. — Bitter Crank
Yes.Most businesses fail because either no one likes what the company offers, the business doesn't find its customers, it's out-competed, or the Russian mafia blows up the store, office, warehouse, lab, what have you. — Bitter Crank
Is that bad luck, or was it maybe planned by someone? >:)Or bad luck -- like an outbreak of food poisoning from your kitchen. — Bitter Crank
America remains the country where immigrants want to come for a better life, despite very clear declarations they are unwelcome, and they do in fact find great success here. If they didn't, they'd stay home. — Hanover
Regardless, it seems that the fact remains that it is possible to go from working class to super-wealthy provided that you have a good product, and you know how to sell it — Agustino
I think you will find that this is a pattern which is far older than the United States. There is no way for any organism to exist without using resources from ecosystems. — Bitter Crank
how many organisms do this — WISDOMfromPO-MO
Not a fair comparison. ~1700 or so, not 500. And those are only official numbers - I have no doubt that there may be a lot of other very rich people who don't appear on those lists. And sure, becoming a billionaire is super difficult. But pretty much everyone could make $1-10 million over their lifetime if this was their goal.I will grant that it is possible for a working class person with a very bright idea and drive to become a billionaire, and out of 7.3 billion people, a minuscule--no, microscopic number, less than 500, are able to do that. But then, so what? 500 out of 7 billion is hardly a groundswell of opportunity. — Bitter Crank
Why do you think in terms of chances? :sIf a black man becomes POTUS, or a woman, this means nothing for the chances of any given black person or woman becoming president. — Bitter Crank
Well yeah, I obviously agree about the sustainable future part. But I don't think that's best achieved by giving 250 million working class people control over wealth. I don't know what makes you think that the 250 million would be good administrators of that wealth.What matters is if 250 million working class people in the United States can gain a reasonable share of the enormous amount of wealth they produce (labor creates all wealth) and can direct that wealth into uses which bring about a sustainable future. — Bitter Crank
Presumably the American Dream is about more than the amount of lucre one has accumulated. Isn't it also about the freedom to think, speak, and act politically; to go anywhere in the country without permission; to enjoy the great outdoors without running into too many fences with NO TRESPASSING signs; to pursue the kind of life one wants to pursue, or at least try; free libraries, health, education, and welfare for all; a wide assortment of religious, social, and political views not just tolerated but expected... ???
Maybe all that is utopian. — Bitter Crank
Do you consider that one becomes a billionaire by chance?Because that is the only way to think of this problem. There is only a limited amount of wealth, not everyone can be a billionaire even though the majority may want to and may work harder than those who are billionaires, so I'd be interested to know in which other ways you might think of this problem that does not involve chance. — René Descartes
This depends. They do not produce that wealth alone but when put in certain systems that are not of their own making. Without those systems, they don't produce wealth, that's why they need the systems - otherwise they'd be working on their own.They are the ones who produce that wealth, so I think more than anyone they would know how to use the wealth they produced through work and labour. — René Descartes
Working hard is not sufficient. I can work hard in digging ditches all my life - I can break my back, and ruin my health doing it, but I probably won't get rich.I know many people who have worked hard all their lives and not even reached such amounts that you talk about. — René Descartes
Last I heard, Zuckerberg's salary as Facebook's CEO was $1 :PThose jobs are far more necessary in society than being a CEO of something like Facebook. Yet they seem to be paid the least in all society for doing some of the most difficult jobs. — René Descartes
No, I just pointed out that being a good wealth-producer isn't the same as being a good wealth manager. Bill Gates doesn't administrate his own wealth for example - he pays others to do it, others who are more knowledgeable than he is at doing that.So you're saying that wealth that you produce should be given to someone else who has not worked at all for that wealth so that they can 'administrate it'. — René Descartes
They don't have much wealth at all, so no administration is needed.What do nomads do, without laws in the wilderness. — René Descartes
Sure, I don't care about the "American dream" or any such notions. I care about the reality. Hard work is not enough to be rich. I generally dislike people who always complain about how hard they work anyway.But the entire American dream states if you work hard enough all your life will achieve success and wealth, even if you start out with nothing you will eventually achieve wealth so by your logic, the American dream is a lie. — René Descartes
This is a social phenomenon. People don't want to do those jobs anymore in developed countries. It's not about the money, for many of those jobs there is a labor shortage, even if some of them are even well-paid. The reason for that is that these people don't have a good social standing, they may be affected by poorer health, less time for family, etc. So if you think that increasing the pay of those jobs to stupendous amounts will solve the problem, you should think again.Also, someone has to dig those trenches, someone has to clean the streets, someone has to go into the mines: when will they receive a fair share of the wealth they work for. Imagine if there was no one to do those jobs, will the rich feel stupid then for not paying them adequately. — René Descartes
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