• BBQueue
    24
    All of the aforementioned systems of beliefs in some way represent the idea that faith in God alone is enough to get anyone into heaven, so long as it is part of their destiny. However, there are two basic problems with this premise, the first being that a Christian who follows it or who claims to follow it can more or less justify living outside of the rules of traditional Christianity and can also justify doing anything else that they want, including things that would normally be considered sinful, just as long as they have faith in God (since faith in God is the only core requirement of Calvinism, for instance). I would even go as far as to suggest that they might not justify going to church since it may as well not be necessary in lieu of a simple faith in God.

    A second issue is that those Christians who are part of a different Christian denomination could take a page out of the book of Calvinism and decide that there is no reason why the premise can't or shouldn't apply to them as well, since anything short of this would be unfair and present an uneven playing field among Christians in general.

    Also who or what is to decide the details of a person's destiny in terms of predestination, and how would could it be determined if this is true, as opposed to simply being made up based on opinion of a person? The entire premise behind this idea is inherently flawed, as there are too many hypotheticals and eventualities to take it seriously in any way.
  • turkeyMan
    119


    I think people who are overworked tend to believe in freewill. I also believe (not in every case) that people who believe in free will are more likely to come up with creative solutions and sometimes work harder than people who embrace stuff such as Calvinism. However i believe Scientific determinism or Calvinism, once a person some how escapes the evils of this world (if they can), is the rational way of looking at things. Scientific determinism will actually lead to more humility not less, but people who are worked too hard will very often embrace freewill because Labor is Labor.
  • Banno
    23.1k
    After the recent pogrom this thread seems unfair.
  • BBQueue
    24
    After the recent pogrom this thread seems unfair.

    As long as those who participated did not have a deliberate Calvinist mindset going into it (and assuming that you are not referring specifically to a riot against Jews), then it should not be unfair. I have to assume that you are not specifically referring to Jews, since I can't identify a RECENT pogrom that has taken place with Jews as the main target, but I doubt if anyone involved in any protest that happened recently was specifically thinking "it's OK for me to commit these violent acts because I still have faith in God, which means that I will be saved no matter what." In fact the truth is likely that none of the protesters were giving a second thought to the religious implications that their actions may or may not have had. I mean let's be honest.
  • tim wood
    8.7k
    All of the aforementioned systems of beliefs in some way represent the idea that faith in God alone is enough to get anyone into heaven, so long as it is part of their destiny.BBQueue

    Incoherent and false and nonsensical! Suggestion: whatever your point is, I think you could get it across in three well-crafted simple sentences - or fewer! Or at least if there is any substance worth discussion, that substance would be more easily made out. Give it a try - three or fewer short sentences.
  • Outlander
    1.8k
    Anything can become corrupted. The idea of an eternal and omnipresent accountability is exactly that. Who do you or did you value or look up most to in life? Why would you want to forever be a murderer, thief, or degenerate in their eyes? Forgiveness doesn't indemnify all just what is needed. Or does it? Depends on your philosophy.
  • aletheist
    1.5k
    All of the aforementioned systems of beliefs in some way represent the idea that faith in God alone is enough to get anyone into heaven, so long as it is part of their destiny.BBQueue
    This is at best an oversimplification of the Christian doctrine of predestination, and there are significant differences in the details of the Calvinist and Lutheran versions. Even Arminians technically affirm predestination, but understand its basis to be God's foreknowledge of who would freely choose to believe, rather than His sovereign choice. In any case, this seems like the kind of theological (rather than philosophical) topic that the moderators have recently requested not to be posted in this forum.
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