• Gnostic Christian Bishop
    685
    Does Jesus qualify as an idol?

    In reading the various definitions of idol, I think Christians have turned Jesus into the type of idol that he railed against.

    We all idol worship in some sense. If you can think analogically you will agree. Here is a poet that might help you do that. He has a good message but he himself ends in being an idol worshiper.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkZg1ZflpJs&list=PL-y1um9fkZCacsUPHZpHsjqdcC4JzZyeT&index=5

    Commandment #3 “You shall have no other gods before[a] me.”

    Christians put Jesus before Yahweh.

    Commandment #4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above,

    Christian churches are full of carved images.

    Gnostic Christians also have an ideal, but we do not let ourselves be subsumed by our own creations and remain perpetual seekers of the best god/rules and laws to live by, as Jesus taught.

    I see Christians and Muslims as idol worshipers.

    Is Jesus a Christian and Muslim idol and are they idol worshipers as most theologians say?

    Regards
    DL
  • A Gnostic Agnostic
    56
    I find not only does Jesus (and Muhammad) qualify as idols, I find both Christianity and Islam require a necessarily false testimony (as contrary to the biblical ten commandments) in their respective required testimonies. In effect, one can not become a Christian/Muslim without violating the testimony commandment - like a mark. One must testify on the basis of a crucifixion and resurrection which happened 2 000 years ago and the other must testify of a man who has been dead for 1 400 years. Isn't the point of a testimony commandment not to bear witness of things unseen and not witnessed? Isn't that the point of not falling into an idolatrous cult that requires a testimony and "belief" in a book or idol? Isn't this what is supposed to shield one from taking up idols and bowing to them etc.? What are these people doing taking these testimonies?

    I know the "believers" say life is a test... I'd hope for their sake it is not. I find even many atheists naturally follow the ten commandments more closely because they intuitively know not to go around killing people. Idol worshipers seem to have problems in this department - spilling blood over books and idols.

    It seems to me any male central figure that serves as a model for humanity is an idol. It takes "belief" to have idol worshipers "believe" that what they are doing by imitating a model man is somehow *not* idol worship. If they are willing to spill blood over it, they are worshiping it, and this relates to fascism and military protection of "belief"-based 'states' (ie. forcibe suppression).
  • New2K2
    7
    What is an idol in the biblical view. An idol is a graven or carved image, spiritual entity or substance that attempts to detract glory from God. The whole point of Jesus's ministry was to show human beings the true and perfected way of worship. Christ himself said " I am in my father and my father in me, he who believes in me believes in my father" also " there is only one way to the Father and that is through the Son" Admittedly due to the current popularity of Christianity and the diverse denominations coming into being everyday a lot of strange philosophies are masquerading as Christian but this was anticipated by the early disciples, it doesn't mean you should separate Jesus from the Christian God or set him up as some sort of apostate or selfcontradiction
  • New2K2
    7
    Christian churches are full of carved images.Gnostic Christian Bishop

    Now to this , the issue of the rosary and other supposedly holy statuary is one that still Sparks debate in Christian gatherings.
    As much as I agree with your assessment of this act as idolatory. Your overly generalistic view of Christianity is not very realistic
  • Gnostic Christian Bishop
    685
    What are these people doing taking these testimonies?A Gnostic Agnostic

    Doing what their lying preachers have done before them. I think of all those who swear to supernatural 7th hand garbage are lying. They just never admit to their hypocrisy.

    spilling blood over books and idols.A Gnostic Agnostic

    Those who have used inquisitions and jihads to kill freedom of religion and thought are the ones who today cry and scream of injustice when their ideology is question or tried to be denied them. Hypocrisy at it's max in this.

    and this relates to fascism and military protection of "belief"-based 'states' (ie. forcibe suppression).A Gnostic Agnostic

    Indeed. People forget how Catholicism helped Hitler, also a fascist, as his banker and helper.

    Your overall view is bang on buddy.

    Regards
    DL
  • Gnostic Christian Bishop
    685
    it doesn't mean you should separate Jesus from the Christian God or set him up as some sort of apostate or selfcontradictionNew2K2

    I see more than one Jesus in scriptures, a Gnostic Christian Jesus and a Rome created one.

    If you see only the Constantine/Rome created Jesus, then you are correct that he cannot be taken out of the Trinity and that makes Jesus/Yahweh a genocidal prick who kills instead of curing, while that same Jesus said he came to cure and not kill. It seem that your Jesus has a split personality.

    The Gnostic Christian Jesus that I know in scriptures would be closer to an Eastern mystic Jesus and would be closer to an apostate than a Christian.

    Here is how the Jesus I follow spoke and you will never see the Christian preachers quote him.

    I have it in an old O.P showing why I call my god I am.

    Modern Gnostic Christians name our god "I am", and yes, we do mean ourselves.

    You are your controller. I am mine. You represent and present whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

    The name "I Am" you might see as meaning something like, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis through Gnosis and meditation.

    In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian tradition that Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, become brethren to Jesus.

    That is why some say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

    Here is the real way to salvation that Jesus taught.

    Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

    John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

    Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

    Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

    Regards
    DL
  • Gnostic Christian Bishop
    685
    As much as I agree with your assessment of this act as idolatory. Your overly generalistic view of Christianity is not very realisticNew2K2

    Nice that you agree.

    What have I put that is not realistic? All Christian fly the cross and there is little difference in their immoral scapegoating ideology.

    Regards
    DL
  • Drazjan
    36
    Catholics have always used idolatry. Praying to statues etc. Buddhists do it too. When Christ was crucified, his followers were left isolated in a pagan world. Pagans loved gimmicks including idolatry. Some pagan gimmicks survived the spread of Christianity. The Christmas tree is one. I suspect the tricks (miracles) were invented to capture the attention of pagans, including Christ's unproven rising from the dead. Too bad they didn't have cell phone cameras. Notice how flying saucer sightings have diminished since the spread of smart phones?
  • A Gnostic Agnostic
    56


    Those who have used inquisitions and jihads to kill freedom of religion and thought are the ones who today cry and scream of injustice when their ideology is question or tried to be denied them. Hypocrisy at it's max in this.

    Yes - I link it to the general idea that "Canaanites" (ie. mark of Kain) attempt to scapegoat the iniquities of their own tribe/house and accuse their political adversaries of the same while whipping up dumbed-down emotionalist "believers" into attacking their own state "believing" the problem is coming from their own state rather than another. That is precisely how Islam fights their jihad - project and scapegoat.

    Now is it obvious why I am undermining "belief" entirely? It takes "believers" to "believe" the problem is the solution and the solution is the problem. Islam is just this and is a humanitarian crisis which is going to wipe women off the face of the planet. It's already got people confused over what a woman is (ie. if one merely "believes" they are a woman, they are one and must be treated as one) because the House of Islam does not want anyone noticing where the "real" women are going... to the Mullahs of the House of Islam. It's all very sick but most people don't understand what is actually going on and the gravity of it. Anyways....

    Indeed. People forget how Catholicism helped Hitler, also a fascist, as his banker and helper.

    I had journalist Benjamin Fulford tell me that he has two sources which indicate the historical Muhammad was actually handled by the Vatican. If this is true (I don't know if it is - I keep pushing him to pursue those sources but he seems reluctant) it obviously would implicate the Vatican as complicit in... pretty much everything humanity has been suffering for a long time, including Islam. I personally know and understand the Qur'an is not what is being claimed... like, at all. It is actually almost absurdly the opposite it is embarrassing, and this is exactly why I feel that the House of Islam is hiding behind the Vatican as much as they can and turning them into a scapegoat as they did/do the Jews.

    This scapegoating is really at the root of evil, and "belief" seems to be the fuel that keeps it going. There needs to be a global political 'state' that rejects "belief" as a basis for existence. Rather than authority over/as truth, we need truth over/as authority. I find "belief" necessarily inverts this, and should be discarded.
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