• frank
    9.6k
    Print money>>buy oil>>magic energy tree! But how to make sure the plebs don't get their fair share? = American politics in a nutshell.Baden

    I need my fair share of the virtual pie!

    The ability to create imaginary wealth is the key to our extreme technological dynamism. In a world without abstract currency we'd stagnate (probably).
  • ssu
    4.9k
    Trump benefitted from the fact that America has the best system money can buy, and he did so from both sides of that corrupt reality. He bought politicians, and publicly bragged about it on national television in front of some of those who he had previously bought, in their presence no less. That happened during the public debate during the primary season of the election

    The fact that were no objections to that was astonishing to me at the time.
    creativesoul

    In a Trump-thread, good that you brought this up from the election between Hillary Clinton and Trump.

    Trump was a great demagogue and a showman that knew what to say to certain crowd that felt disenfranchised. The vast majority of Americans really don't like the corrupt system that is made now legal and that gives power to the rich and corporations through lobbyists and the "revolving-door". Trump just told what they knew already: the whole thing is rigged for the rich. Americans both in the left and in the right simply hate this, but naturally the bi-partisan effort from the two ruling parties is to make Americans hate each other, hate the citizens supporting the other political side. That's the way I guess how to get people to vote for a system they don't like.

    We no longer have a government that places the best interests of the overwhelming majority of Americans at the top of the priority list when making policy decisions. We legalized government bribery in the seventies by changing how it is described, in the guise of characterizing unlimited campaign contributions by very rich individuals as an exercise in an individual's first amendment rights to "free speech". Now there are all sorts of counterarguments that outright reject that argument and do so convincingly, but this is not he place or time. I digress, the SCOTUS set the precedent for legalized bribery to manifest with that decision. Then, president Nixon placed the attorney who argued that case on the court itself. A few years later the court then expanded the ability to bribe elected officials to include a corporation's ability, because corporations are people too. Then, of course, Citizen's United not that long ago...

    The current American government is tremendously corrupt, and that is well known and out in the open.
    creativesoul
    This is why I think you are headed for the American equivalent of "the Time of Troubles".

    If 2022 goes without any major things happening, you might sigh in relief, becayse if you think that you have already seen how ugly it will get, you will be in for a surprise...
  • ssu
    4.9k
    Print money>>buy oil>>magic energy tree! But how to make sure the plebs don't get their fair share? = American politics in a nutshell.Baden
    Indeed. The real question is how long it will last.
  • Baden
    12.5k


    As long as the US and the Saudi Royal mafia remain best buds, I guess.
  • NOS4A2
    5.4k


    Pure contextomy. He’s not insistent on anything to do with the military, and you pretended that he insisted Trump should get the military to seize voting machines. You furtively left out what exactly it was he was insistent about (appointing a special counsel and investigating the machines and elections) in favor of pretending his hypotheticals were some form of advice to Trump. But the hosts questions clearly distinguish between what Flynn thinks Trump should do and what he could do. You took from the “could” pile and pretended it belonged on the “should” pile. Even now you can’t even post the whole interview!! Utter lies.
  • unenlightened
    6.2k
    Shamelessly stealing this from EnPassant in the climate thread. Not even new, but illuminates this ahem,"discussion". "Catabolic capitalism" - a really useful concept, hurl it at your interlocutor.

    https://www.counterpunch.org/2021/02/15/can-we-exit-this-road-to-ruin
  • Paine
    174
    I am not sure about all the fancy theories regarding political theater versus why the people on the stage are put there.
    But the problem of who has a vote or does not has been a problem that keeps showing up with all the other problems.
    Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
  • ssu
    4.9k
    As long as the US and the Saudi Royal mafia remain best buds, I guess.Baden

    Yeah.

    Well, that relationship of yours has successfully passed through 9/11, so I guess it will last a long time...

    Even if the US isn't so dependent on Saudi oil as before, I guess it will remain.

    After all, even Trump was on loyal friend of the Saudi regime.
  • ssu
    4.9k
    Pure contextomy.NOS4A2

    Oh the words don't mean what they mean?

    Try to wiggle out of it, troll, try!
  • NOS4A2
    5.4k


    Your furtive attempts to further a conspiracy theory in a country that is not your own is the going rate, ssu. Get in line.
  • NOS4A2
    5.4k
    Leader of Oath Keepers and 10 Other Individuals Indicted in Federal Court for Seditious Conspiracy and Other Offenses Related to U.S. Capitol Breach

    These are the first sedition-related charges in the capitol riot. Apparently one of the defendants is actually on Tucker Carlson right now, which is stupid if you care to beat the charges.
  • frank
    9.6k
    How could they beat the charges?
  • Wayfarer
    14.7k
    Washington (CNN) Trump campaign officials, led by Rudy Giuliani, oversaw efforts in December 2020 to put forward illegitimate electors from seven states that Trump lost, according to three sources with direct knowledge of the scheme.

    The sources said members of former President Donald Trump's campaign team were far more involved than previously known in the plan, a core tenet of the broader plot to overturn President Joe Biden's victory when Congress counted the electoral votes on January 6.

    Giuliani and his allies coordinated the nuts-and-bolts of the process on a state-by-state level, the sources told CNN. One source said there were multiple planning calls between Trump campaign officials and GOP state operatives, and that Giuliani participated in at least one call. The source also said the Trump campaign lined up supporters to fill elector slots, secured meeting rooms in statehouses for the fake electors to meet on December 14, 2020, and circulated drafts of fake certificates that were ultimately sent to the National Archives.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2022/01/20/politics/trump-campaign-officials-rudy-giuliani-fake-electors/index.html
  • Raymond
    815


    Man! The man of fake news!
  • Wayfarer
    14.7k
    yeah after all the kvetching about election fraud, now it seems the only actual instances of it were actually coming from him. Somehow that is not surprising. I'm really hoping he gets hit with criminal charges soon, although I'm not holding my breath.
  • Raymond
    815


    Yeah, a man always pressing fake news is probably himself spreading it. I heard that he wants to go for president again. Will the people still buy that? Or are they truly blinded?
  • Wayfarer
    14.7k
    I heard that he wants to go for president again.Raymond

    Of course, people have been saying that since he lost, and he keeps implying it, but he would only run if he absolutely knew he would win, and I'm sure he won't.
  • StreetlightX
    8k
    Ah yes, the polls. They have been so useful in the past.
  • Wayfarer
    14.7k
    Yeah, true that. Regardless, although I'm not a betting man, I would bet money that Trump won't run again, although I'm not going to get into a debate about it.
  • StreetlightX
    8k
    I guess I don't see how he could not. The Republican party is the Trump party, and, if you do like polls:

    But a new Gallup poll shows that the public standing of President Joe Biden’s party has dropped rapidly over the last year, raising the likelihood that it will face a serious shellacking in November. In the first quarter of 2021, about 49% of Americans identified with or leaned toward the Democratic Party, compared with just 40% for the Republican Party, according to Gallup. By the fourth quarter, however, that advantage had been completely lost, with 47% of Americans surveyed identifying with or leaning toward the GOP, and just 42% of Americans identifying as Democrats.That’s a swing of 14 points in just one year, the largest shift Gallup has seen in its 30 years of polling.

    https://fortune.com/2022/01/19/democrats-party-preference-falls-gallup-poll-history-republicans/

    So yeah.
  • Wayfarer
    14.7k
    I won't believe it unless I see it.
  • ssu
    4.9k
    Yeah, a man always pressing fake news is probably himself spreading it. I heard that he wants to go for president again. Will the people still buy that? Or are they truly blinded?Raymond
    They are not blind. And yes, as you said, a person always calling everyone else a liar is the usually the biggest liar. You see, these persons usually genuinely believe all people to be liars so the person thinks that lying is just the way the World works. For Trump lying is totally normal. It's the way he works and how he thinks the world works. After all, he has gotten to be President, he has been able to create this picture of being a billionaire when nearly bankrupt, so everything he has done reinforces his own twisted worldview. Objective truth is for idiots and losers.

    With Trump supporters it's just like with the case of conspiracy theorists. Naively you would assume that a conspiracy theorist would want truth, honesty and objectivity upholded. Bullshit. Nothing is farther from them. You see, they promote willingly the most obvious propaganda as ever, because they assume everything they hear on the evil mainstream media to be propaganda. Everything. It's not a world where a journalist might get something right and something wrong and may have some bias. It's all and everything. So to counter this evil propaganda, you have your own propaganda. Everything is just propaganda. You counter the other sides propaganda with your own and with propaganda truth doesn't matter, but that you win the argument and support your side.

    Hence it doesn't matter what crimes Trump is accused of, it's all simply propaganda. No need to hear it, no need to take it into consideration as only the people who are against you promote it.
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