• Rich
    3.2k
    This is specific enough. That you wish to stuff your mind into neurons is not my problem.
  • celebritydiscodave
    76


    To the delusion of what, free will, or determinism? The notion of determinism is thrust upon one but the notion of free will never is. OP? Somebody over the age of sixty six you mean, who`s that, in any event you are plainly rank with age prejudice. Prejudice never exists in just the one area, so much of your thinking then may well be prejudicial, and I`ve never known a person that is afflicted with forwards age prejudice not also to be afflicted with reverse age prejudice. It is just knowing how to bring it out onto the surface.
    Determinism does n`t make anything pointless, and without it our lives would be a chaotic nightmare.
  • Rich
    3.2k
    Determinism does n`t make anything pointless, and without it our lives would be a chaotic nightmare.celebritydiscodave

    If everything is fated then life does become meaningless. At least the Calvinists have a Heaven to look forward to. Determinists seemed determined to wring everything meaningful out of life, most especially the ability to manifest spontaneous creativity. As it happens, pretty much no one really believes it. There are however lots of economic reasons for is continued promotion, both directly and indirectly.

    As for this position chaos, all of nature as it exist depends upon both spontaneity as well as learned habits as part of is evolution. What we observe is the result of this evolutionary process. Sometimes a gentle breeze will blow and sometimes there is a tsunami. Neither is determined but rather is a result of continual evolution.
  • celebritydiscodave
    76
    But it is n`t fated, not on a level which should concern us, for we all have our own personal to us individual course, and it is only meaningless to those which experience no meaning. I`m one individual that requires no more meaning than I already have, it means everything to me, and there are many more like me..
  • VagabondSpectre
    1.2k
    If you wish to guess that your mind has residence anywhere but in your brain, that's your supernatural prerogative.

    Determinists seemed determined to wring everything meaningful out of life, most especially the ability to manifest spontaneous creativity. As it happens, pretty much no one really believes it.Rich

    You insist that determinism makes things meaningless as if some magical free-will force is necessary for meaning in the first place.

    I say spontaneous creativity comes from the complexity of neural networks and their environment, and you say spontaneous creativity either comes from quantum randomness or some magical and indescribable event that makes it even better than the unfathomable complexity we actually can observe in the real world.

    This is why I accuse anti-determinists of lacking imagination. They're so concerned with their own fantastical interpretations of the world that they can no longer stand to look at things as they are. The observable universe is already larger than we can ever explore, and beyond the observable, who knows? (probably more of the same though).

    Maybe god and free-will exist, but why sit around making assumptions about things for which we have no evidence or indication? There's no hard evidence for god, souls, or free will, but there is evidence that human behavior can be predicted; there's evidence that human behavior is tied into cause and effect.

    If you think presuming free will is a better starting assumption (for exploring reality) than presuming determinism, so be it, but behavioral sciences (and science in general) which presume the pervasiveness of cause and effect in some cases can predict your own supposedly free behavior better than you can.

    See: https://www.nature.com/articles/nn.2112
  • Rich
    3.2k
    If you wish to guess that your mind has residence anywhere but in your brain, that's your supernatural prerogative.VagabondSpectre

    Not reading any further. Read about the enteric brain. Then spend your life understanding your body And have done. Bye bye.
  • VagabondSpectre
    1.2k
    Babbling about the enteric brain and quantum particles makes for uninteresting philosophy though, just as uninteresting as capitalizing words you revere and telling people to get educated about them.

    I'm really stubborn, admittedly, so you're probably doing me a favor (not that you could have chosen any differently of course, so I don't hold it against you!) Toodles!
  • CasKev
    392
    @VagabondSpectre

    Determinists seemed determined to wring everything meaningful out of life, most especially the ability to manifest spontaneous creativity.Rich

    How can you wring something out when it's not there to begin with? What grand meaning is there to life, aside from what has been biologically programmed (i.e. survival)? Determined or not, fated or not, there's no other real known point to life.
  • Rich
    3.2k

    Totally agree with your description of yourself.
  • CasKev
    392
    @Rich

    Finally we agree on something! X-)
  • Rich
    3.2k
    Meaningless religion being pushed as science in academia for dehumanization and economic gains. I hope people ignore the Bot-ization of Life and find a more creative Life through the arts or sports or similar.
  • CasKev
    392
    So a bunch of people sitting around painting pictures and playing music would be somehow more meaningful? To what end?
  • Rich
    3.2k
    So a bunch of people sitting around painting pictures and playing music would be somehow more meaningful? To what end?CasKev

    Try it and LEARN about Life. This is real Evolution.

    Scientific dehumanization stagnates Life and creates meaningless, depression, bad health, and worse. Movement, spiritual, emotional, mental, and physical creates an harmonious Life.

    Life Flows.
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