• JesseAdanMartinez
    1
    I'm raising/razing a metaethical discussion on the ethical order of the Greek Olympian pantheon and their rightful place in Science Aesthetics and Tragedy.


    The Birth of Tragedy / Out Of The Spirit Of Music By Friedrich Nietzsche.

    Google: Nietzsche argues that the tragedy of Ancient Greece was the highest form of art due to its mixture of both Apollonian and Dionysian elements into one seamless whole, allowing the spectator to experience the full spectrum of the human condition. The combination of these elements in one art form gave birth to tragedy.

    BOT “We shall have gained much for the science of aesthetics, once we perceive not merely by logical inference, but with the immediate certainty of vision, that the continuous development of art is bound up with the Apollinian and Dionysian duality–just as procreation depends on the duality of sexes, involving perpetual strife with only periodically intervening reconciliations. The terms Dionysian and Apollinian we borrow from the Greeks, who disclose to the discerning mind the profound mysteries of their view of art, not, to be sure, in concepts, but in the intensely clear figures of their gods. Through Apollo and Dionysus, the two art deities of the Greeks, we come to recognize that in the Greek world there existed a tremendous opposition, in origin and aims, between the Apolloinian art of sculpture, and the nonimaginistic, Dionysian art of music. These two different tendencies run parallel to each other to new and more powerful births, which perpetuate an antagonism, only superficially reconciled by the common term “art”; till eventually, by a metaphysical miracle of the Hellenic “will”, they appear coupled with each other, and through this coupling ultimately generate an equally Dionysian and Apollinian form of art–Attic tragedy.” - Page One paragraph one in The Birth Of Tragedy.

    —------------------------------------------------------------------------

    My rebuttal to Dionysian’s, “We shall have gained much for the science of aesthetics”, is there only begins to gain in science and aesthetics after death, Hades, “We shall begin science and aesthetics.” Death rests his case in eternal silence or death, rest in peace. Death. Who’s Death? “Hades knocks on wood.” The Trident, question soul and get an answer in three. Spell it in water, “TRIDENT SOUL QUESTION”. Poseidon is who brooked all the rock with water and Apollo only lye's the rocks to shambles. Nietzsche began in inference where I began in a deduction from Hades who is dead silent in his response. Therefore sound deduction and not inference is the beginning of science, in dead silence not organic contradiction. Second recognizing the unbearableness of the trident soul argument is the wake of Poseidon who breaks all rock in his wake and is not a lyre like Apollo. Therefore death is nonimaginistic not Dionysus, and Poseidon's trident wake sculpts rock not Apollos lye in wake. Death leads the real wake of Attic tragedy is. Attic Tragedy is a barbarian at your door, your wife is in the Attic. How do you know to avoid tragedy and know only necessary wife and no possible wife? Begin in the beginning from dead start, face and find your unbroken trident and soul thrust, “I know nothing of possible wife, and the Olympus’ Acropolis is Necessary for break-fast neighbor, otherwise we only have a Trident argument for you, for what is piety is to have no soul contradiction in argument with me ‘barbarian’!”


    So do you guys thing Nietzsche was right or wrong to assert Dionysus and Apollo as meta for "Musician" and "Sculptor", over Hades and Poseidon? I think Hades rules soundness and Poseidon just inference over all science and art over Dionysus and Apollo. Because cannon fodder to death Hades as sound in tradition and therefore begin soundness from Hades. Second because the trinity argument for God, Father Son Holy Ghost is baptism of soul in trinity of, "Being. Greatest assumption of being? Answers is Beinghood." In Greek water is like Poseidon baptized in trident as, "Water. Who is greatest water? Poseidon baptizes Greeks in water." Therefore Poseidon is the soul trident that uses water to break rock and sculpt men with water like souls like Jesus will later, but Hades kills brothers name as baptizer and then Jesus does in Hades. Amen.

    Jesse Adan Martinez Rests Alpha Omega Tragedy case for raising/razing.
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    Indeed, any form of anything, art too, that includes order (Apollo) & chaos (Dionysus) is necessarily complete (knowledge of good and evil)! There's tragedy in order and tragedy in chaos and tragedy in everything in between; pessimism unleashed or is it the candour of realism?

    We should all be crying our hearts out, but that's hilarious! :grin:
  • Astrophel
    359
    We should all be crying our hearts out, but that's hilarious!Agent Smith

    Saved by irony? Is this truly the best we can do? Does "the world" really hand this to us as its essential bottom line?
    Art in literature and history (difference? I think they are nearly identical), of course, are nothing without irony, and humor is literally made of it. Nietzsche loved Wagner, but his thoughts were bound up with drama. He loved the "narrative" (read "affect" of irony) of life brought into existence. This is what you get with a sick man who has known only physical suffering his whole life: for Nietzsche, living and breathing was an epic struggle. Naturally, he would work this up into a world view of inherent annihilation. What I mean is that when all affirmation of the world is denied any genuine foundation that can validate it, one ends up with tragedy. All of our affairs are tragic, therefore. But then, is this where thoughts on the matter end?
    To speak of Gods, with a capital G, not as fictions but metaphorically as standins for something actual and basic, is to speak of underpinnings that are, if you will, their own presuppositions, that are flat out unanalyzable, and defy reduction altogether. What is Apollo? Is he the Socratic principle? And Dionysus, the impossible defiance of just this impulse to order? Impossible because the thing that can stand against reason cannot be conceived (to do so would be to bring the world to heel under the Socratic tyranny).
    To me, this is where it gets interesting. Take the Birth of Tragedy for what it is: a meta narrative that presents a world lost in struggle and tragedy. But then, take a close look at this: the struggle itself is analyzable, for struggles are never abstractions. It is not as if we are in a failed logical proof whose conclusion is an ad absurdum. What is in play is actual value. The question is, what is this?
  • Agent Smith
    9.5k
    What is in play is actual value. The question is, what is this?Astrophel

    O horror, horror, horror!
    Tongue nor heart cannot conceive nor name thee!...
    Confusion now hath made his masterpiece.
    — Macduff
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