• Athena
    1.8k
    Nuclear warheads and other NBC type weapons are really only useful as a deterrent to preventing another country from trying to invade you since you could "theoretically" get away with using a nuke against a military force (somewhere outside of your country where they are building up for an invasion) if that force was much too big for your own military to deal with. Also they can be useful if you need to strong arm a neighboring country that has powerful conventional forces but no nuke themselves.dclements

    Man, just take out our satellites and almost completely destroy the US defense system and the ability to support it. Without those satellites to keep our technology functioning, I don't think the US would have a defense. :lol: I would give them 3 days before they are on the streets killing each other with their own guns.
  • dclements
    339
    Good analysis! :up:.TheMadFool
    Thanks! :D

    I just hope that it isn't that far off from what is currently going on.

    I'm hoping this'll happen sooner or later. Individuals usually get tired of the toys they have - they get bored and what was before an exciting plaything becomes dull and fails to evoke the, thrilling as hell, dopamine rush.TheMadFool
    I agree. I believe if the US doesn't either bow down nor poke the panda too much we should be ok as long as China doesn't become much more aggressive than they already are.
  • dclements
    339
    Man, just take out our satellites and almost completely destroy the US defense system and the ability to support it. Without those satellites to keep our technology functioning, I don't think the US would have a defense. :lol: I would give them 3 days before they are on the streets killing each other with their own guns.Athena
    If they decided to start shooting down satellites, I think that the US wouldn't take that very lightly and we would do everything in our power to send some more satellites to replace the one's we lost. While the loss of multi-million dollar satellites wouldn't be a great thing to happen, it wouldn't really cause that much harm if they didn't follow up with such an attack with some kind of military action.

    I don't know that the US could really do to China if they did such a thing, but I'm guessing it wouldn't help them much to do such an action since it would definitely cause the US to be less friendly when they start destroying military and/or civilian assets for no other reason then they felt like doing so.
  • dclements
    339
    After watching the following video I'm under the impression that living in any place that is under control of Chinese Communist Party would be really no more different than living in the world describe in George Orwell's book "1984". I don't know if it is really any better or worst then living in the USSR during the cold war but it is a bit unsettling to realize that living in present day China is not all that different then being a citizen that has to live in North Korea.



    It make me nervous to think that such a government is in control of the second most power country in the world after the US.
  • Athena
    1.8k
    If they decided to start shooting down satellites, I think that the US wouldn't take that very lightly and we would do everything in our power to send some more satellites to replace the one's we lost. While the loss of multi-million dollar satellites wouldn't be a great thing to happen, it wouldn't really cause that much harm if they didn't follow up with such an attack with some kind of military action.

    I don't know that the US could really do to China if they did such a thing, but I'm guessing it wouldn't help them much to do such an action since it would definitely cause the US to be less friendly when they start destroying military and/or civilian assets for no other reason then they felt like doing so.
    dclements

    War is insanity. Fortunately, we have international law and international organizations that might prevent war, and this was not so in the past. For sure China is testing all boundaries. A check of what Chinese citizens think of the US is not good. https://www.gzeromedia.com/the-graphic-truth-how-do-chinese-people-view-america It is concerning to me that China has invested so much in military might, considering from our point of view, no one is threatening China. The majority of Chinese citizens have an unfavorable opinion of the US and I think this should concern us. Things were not always like this. When Nixon was cozying up to China, it was fashionable to have clothing reflecting Chinese fashion. We learned of Tao, I Ching, and The Art of War. Something has gone very wrong and I think it is good to attempt to understand why.
  • dclements
    339
    War is insanity. Fortunately, we have international law and international organizations that might prevent war, and this was not so in the past. For sure China is testing all boundaries. A check of what Chinese citizens think of the US is not good. https://www.gzeromedia.com/the-graphic-truth-how-do-chinese-people-view-america It is concerning to me that China has invested so much in military might, considering from our point of view, no one is threatening China. The majority of Chinese citizens have an unfavorable opinion of the US and I think this should concern us. Things were not always like this. When Nixon was cozying up to China, it was fashionable to have clothing reflecting Chinese fashion. We learned of Tao, I Ching, and The Art of War. Something has gone very wrong and I think it is good to attempt to understand why.Athena
    I'm not too sure that either international law and international organizations will be able to do much in preventing a war with China or at least any more than people in China itself have a say in stopping those in power who want to start a war. As I mentioned in previous posts the real reasons why China wasn't already invaded Taiwan and is still waiting to do so is that they are worried of what the possible negative repercussions will be if they invade Taiwan and the US comes to their aid.

    Here is a video explaining what it would be like if the US went to war with China (using only convention military and no nukes) and what the potential outcome for China would be:



    While it isn't a given that the US would want to expand a conflict in Taiwan to China itself, I imagine it is doubtful that we would want to sit on our hands have navy units sit idle and let Taiwan get bombarded by Chinese aircraft/navy units if we have the capacity to do so. The long and short of this means that China's only hope would be to invade and take Taiwan with so much speed that neither the military in Taiwan nor the US would be able to react quick enough to stop it and for the US to just give up after Taiwan was taken over. However this is fairly unlikely since it would likely take days or even months for China to prepare and do this, the US and Taiwan would likely know about an invasion before it even started, and a mobilized/fortified Taiwan could put up enough resistance long enough for the US (and any allies) to intervene to make taking over Taiwan that much more difficult. If the war is fought in the near future and US intervenes with China's invasion of Taiwan it is basically game over for China. It isn't a given that the US and her allies would be about to take out of her navy and air force but it is most likely they would suffer enough losses that they would no longer be able to project as much naval/air power as they do right now and any naval blockade and other economic repercussions that it is most likely they would rather try to make peace before the US had to mount a full invasion of China itself. Although it is also possible for China no to want to stop such a war even at that point, the problems of a protracted war with US and any allies after an effective naval blockade/ceasing of their global export/imports would be even more devastating to their economy and that would take away the one ace up China's sleeve when it comes to them being a global superpower - their economy.

    It isn't that surprising that currently many Chinese have a negative impression of the US since many people in other countries that we are allied with along with people in the US have a negative impression with either the Us government and/or the people that live here. Part of the issue with the negative impress some of them have is that the US is still enough of a super power that we can still effectively put a wet blanket on some of their efforts to become the world's biggest super power and even their desire to become effectively become the biggest super power in Asia. I believe the US is still the biggest influencer in Asia, but of course it is almost a given that every day China seems to be getting closer to challenging us in that position. In the upcoming years China may be better prepared than they are today, but at the present I believe China is not really ready to take on the US.

    Oddly enough, while their desire to take on Taiwan for national reasons may be bad enough to stir up some irk from people outside China, I also believe that they are rational enough not to undertake such desire. The reason is simply that if they try to invade Taiwan, it will become like a military " honeypot" for them - or something that seems valuable when you try and get it but in the end is much more trouble than it is ever worth. While the US's position is that they don't actively seek to go to war with any country, they are willing to fight with any country that tries to invade any friendly democratic countries that didn't do anything to provoke such an invasion. In essence, while we don't like China's flexing it's economic/military (and it's ability to do even more about it in the future) we can't really do anything about right now because they are doing anything enough for the US to take action about it. HOWEVER if China did invade Taiwan it would totally change the context of the problem and it would motivate the average American (and even some of the citizens in allying countries) for the US to no longer sit on our hands and for us to do much more against China's attempt at becoming a big of super power as the US itself.

    In an odd way if China really hopes to become a super power as the US they are going to put their national desire of taking over Taiwan and other places on hold and do better at having more allies then they have at the present. However this is also very unlikely because the more they build up their military and give more speeches about how they are going to use their military to get what they want, it sours almost any alliance they might have with other democratic countries. While China in and of itself is powerful, it is unlikely they are or willing be powerful enough to take on any real military target unilaterally and deal with the consequences of doing so.

    While many people in the world may not have a favorable view of the US and/or our government, they at least many of them feel that it isn't as bad as it would be if China became the world's biggest superpower and was able to challenge us more than they can at the present. It may not sound like a great excuse for the US to point out that we are at least not as horrible to our own citizens and other countries as China can be, but this small sliver of civility we have with other countries along with other diplomatic measures is part of the reasons we are able to keep countries like China and/or Russia in check and thwart the measures they try to take to try and expand on their own empires any more than they already do. I imagine if either China or Russia had better relations with other countries (other than just each other) and their own people it might be easier for them to expand, however something tells me it isn't always easy having "friends" when your running a country like China, Russia, or even the US for that matter.

    In a way it is kind of like the old children's story of the dog with two bones, sometimes it might be better to just be happy with what you have then to be greedy and risk losing it while trying to get something else. Unfortunately such wisdom is often lost when it comes to leaders of powerful countries who more often than not got to power by taking huge risk and by being for lack of a better word incredibly greedy when it comes to choices they make even when they already have all the power when it comes to running their own country.

    http://leejohndrow.com/a-dog-with-two-bones-a-tale-of-choice/

    I believe this is also a problem with some people that manage to start up and create their own business. When I worked at a local casino as a slot tech, I would often hear about people that own their own business that had gambling problems who's debts were so bad that they ended up having to give up the businesses they owned to the casino. I'm not sure if it is a given that people who took such risk in running a business are more likely to have issues than other people, but it is hard for me to fathom how someone that is has enough savvy to run a business would be foolship enough to lose it merely due to gambling unless they had a real issue with it. Also it seems people born in Asian cultures like to gamble more than people that are not. I'm not sure if these issues will play a part in whether China actually tries to invade Taiwan, but I'm sure we will find out in the near future. I'm pretty sure the new rulers in China are more aggressive/willing to take on huge risks than the people they replaced, but I believe it is doubtful they are foolish enough for them to be willing to risk/sacrifice the bone that they have in merely the hopes of getting another one.
  • dclements
    339
    I just got an interesting insight into this issue, someone pointed out to me that Xi Jinping is 68 years old and it is possible he may want to create a kind of legacy before he gets to old, passes, etc.

    This is an interesting variable into why China is so much more interested in taking Taiwan, if the leader of China wants to cement what China did under his rule there would be no better action then China taking Taiwan against the will of the Us and the rest of the west in doing so. I don't know if such a desire would be enough for him to follow through (likely even in the face of some of his top generals) but from some people in Xi's position personal ambition often can trump real issues in taking such actions.

    Also another factor is if Xi is 68 and he is aware of past hopes of taking Taiwan he may realize that the US has never really allowed China to have a good window of opportunity for invading Taiwan. In fact, the only thing they can really hope for is that it is almost a given that their soldiers will be willing to fight to take Taiwan, it is not so well know if US and allied soldiers are willing to do the same or if US politicians have the stomach to go through with such a war. Personally I think it is almost a given that we would be willing to fight considering what is at stake, but it is plausible that Xi's belief is that the US and our allies will falter in the face of such a conflict and the invasion/taking of Taiwan won't be as much trouble as the US imagines it would be.

    If this insight does anything it is a good enough reason for any why Xi and the rest of China are so willing to turn up the war rhetoric and deal with the possible negative consequences of looking so aggressive in the face of other countries. I guess all we can do is see what Xi is willing to do to achieve such ambitions.
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