Perhaps it is futile, but there sure is something that is not explained. Quite unlike what we can explain in relation to moving bodies. That we can explain. Consciousness no. Regardless of whether you are correct that they don't know what they are looking for or haven't defined it well. But we have this phenomenon - experiencing - and we don't know what causes it, what is necessary for it to occur. Waht has it and what does not. We do not what moves. We do not what it takes for the bones of a living creature to shift from one position to another when not being affected to do this by outside forces. We know muscle physiology and the nervous system. We do not know why experiencing is happening. Is it a mechanism? a facet of all matter? We do not know. The challenge, yes, is made hard by the fact that so far we don't seem, at least in science, to have direct access to other minds.

The highest form of awareness is "being aware of being aware",
— Alkis Piskas
Can that not go on forever? Are you aware that you're aware that you're aware? — universeness

You mean something like "I know that I know that I know ....", right? Well, you can do that if you like and not have anything better to do! :grin: But not if you want to sleep. It will keep you awake! :grin:
Otherwise, just "I know that I know" is enough. It tells all.

But better than looking at the subject conceptually, you can try experiment and have a direct knowledge and experience of it: Just be aware of your environment and notice a sound, or picture or whatever else you like. Then, be aware that you are doing that. I first discovered this ability of "being aware of being aware" when I was young and during a night when I couldn't catch a sleep. It was an amazing revelation and experience! You see, we are having thoughts --trying to solve a problem, imagining a nice day on the beach, ...-- and this is so normal that we are simply used to it. We know well that we are doing that and never be aware that we are doing that or ask who is doing that. And justifiably so. Why should we? What would such a thing serve to? Well, at first, nothing more than a proof that we exist and that we are humans! :grin: Not a big deal, eh? But then we can use that to view our thoughts, problems, emotions and a lot of other things in which we are getting too involved in and being catpured by, from an external, detached point of view. This helps in more things that you one can imagine --including myself! :grin:.

It does not exist in any other form of life.
— Alkis Piskas
How do know that for sure? — universeness

Good question. How could I know if I cannot live as an animal for a while, just to verify that? So, this can be only inferred from the differences we know well between humans and animals, and if that are not enough we can also used some reasoning and/or imagination. Try to think of any animal doing what I described in my previous comment. How long could you hold such a thought? Not even a second. Except of course if you are a cartoon designer! :grin:

Does any aspect of the mind exist in the body? Is all of what you refer to as mind non-physical? Does any aspect of what you refer to as mind reside/exist in the body in your opinion? — universeness

As I said, and as I personally know, understand and can experience, mind is non-physical. And as such, it has no location, since only physical things are located in space. But see, I really don't care about that. In what would that help me? I only care about the manifestations of the mind, how it works and its effects on the body and on itself (feedback).

They must be free to flow everywhere and permeate everything.
— Alkis Piskas
Do you mean that what you are referring to as 'mind' can travel? or are you suggesting there is an aspect of mind which is omnipresent? — universeness

Nothing of the two. I used that just an expression I felt nice about! :grin:
But more specifically, if you want, I was tallk about well defined terms and ideas, which are independent of any framework and thus can stand and be used and be applied everywere --when appropriate, of course.

But not if you want to sleep. It will keep you awake! :grin:
Otherwise, just "I know that I know" is enough. It tells all. — Alkis Piskas

Yeah, I think that you could make too many voices in your head with that one but if you can be satisfied with I am aware that I am aware then fair enough. Doesn't do it for me, unfortunately!

But then we can use that to view our thoughts, problems, emotions and a lot of other things in which we are getting too involved in and being catpured by, from an external, detached point of view. — Alkis Piskas

Stand outside yourself and observe the processes of your own mind. Yes, I do that but as I have said to you before, using my best mental efforts, I only ever perceive 3 combatants/teammates/characters. Perhaps this is just because I have only been able to see the brain as a triune system ever since Carl Sagan told me so in his books. Any one of me, myself and I can stand outside the other two and observe /listen to their viewpoints/fears/joys etc. Sometimes they fight and slag each other off, other times they unite and are focused and very sure about what they are doing. This works well for me. Perhaps it is just a case of well, whatever keeps your boat afloat.
Still, I would like to know a great deal more so I turn to those actively involved in investigating consciousness for more insight but I also enjoy reading about how other people such as you, perceive themselves.

Try to think of any animal doing what I described in my previous comment. How long could you hold such a thought? — Alkis Piskas

I am not so convinced. I have read about many examples of animal intelligence. From Koko the gorilla to base info stuff such as Most Intelligent Animals.

Nothing of the two. I used that just an expression I felt nice about! — Alkis Piskas

Fair enough but I personally, need a lot more than that. It's good to feel nice and be 'content' with your own musings about consciousness/awareness but I will always seek proof. Even if I never get it, I will die seeking it and die happy in the effort.

This has turned into a personal exchange since quite some time ago. Please look at your INBOX.

Ok.