The problem is that the Left desires equality of outcome — synthesis

Okay, synth, two can play your stupid game. If the left desires equality of outcome and you're against it that means that you desire inequality of outcome. Why do you want that? Is it because you're successful and want others to be unsucessful so you can feel good about yourself? That demonstrates insecurity. Why are you so insecure?

I can go on painting a silly caricature of you and pretend that I'm having a worthwhile discussion, if you like.

Who have I called a racist? I'm saying that the Right bemoans terms like "woke", all the while relying upon other thought-terminating clichés, thus a double-standard.

If the left desires equality of outcome and you're against it that means that you desire inequality of outcome. Why do you want that? — praxis

People are successful for a lot of reasons outside of hard work. Maybe they are really attractive. Perhaps they are super intelligent, or just incredibly nice people. How about those folks who had successful parents and they made success for them a priority? These attributes significantly help people along the way.

Even if it was preferable, you cannot engineer a society to create equality. The best you can do it try to offer everybody maximum opportunity, and you do that through getting out of the way and allowing people to do their thing. This means limiting the power of the few to control others. Minimize governments, get rid of corporations, so on and so forth. Go small and de-centralize.

you do that through getting out of the way and allowing people to do their thing. This means limiting the power of the few to control others. Minimize governments, get rid of corporations, so on and so forth. Go small and de-centralize. — synthesis

“Allowing people to do their thing” by forcing them to “Minimize governments, get rid of corporations, so on and so forth”?

Yes, it's called freedom.

Who have I called a racist? I'm saying that the Right bemoans terms like "woke", all the while relying upon other thought-terminating clichés, thus a double-standard. — thewonder

Everybody should be talking about how we can be freer. That is the key to tremendous success in any society. Right, left, up, down, who cares? If you are talking about freedom (especially economic), that's a good thing. If you are talking about controlling others through governments and corporations, that's a bad thing.

Yes, it's called freedom. — synthesis

Restricting what folks can and can’t do isn’t freedom.

Restricting what folks can and can’t do isn’t freedom. — praxis

If restricting means limiting the power of governments and corporations, then restrict away. Increase the power of the individual. It's the only way to unleash the productive powers of a society.

The best you can do it try to offer everybody maximum opportunity, and you do that through getting out of the way and allowing people to do their thing. — synthesis

Amusing to have this set out explicitly. I would have thought its absurdity obvious, but privilege hides privilege from the privileged.

If restricting means limiting the power of governments and corporations, then restrict away. Increase the power of the individual. It's the only way to unleash the productive powers of a society. — synthesis

Individuals would have dominion over governments and corporations in your dream society? If so, which individuals?

An off-topic forum is like a coffee shop. A philosophy forum is about philosophy. The problem is that those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it. And I am surprised that your opinions are of an adult, especially since they tell me "Kant in vain... Kant in vain... Kant in vain..." It is something amazing and sad.

Individuals would have dominion over governments and corporations in your dream society? If so, which individuals? — praxis

You might want to sit down and read the U.S. Constitution. It's about individuals.

Oh yeah, and written by people who owned other people.

You've got to leave the past in the past. Everybody knows that all kinds of crazy and bizarre things have happened throughout the history of humanity, but the reason we all enjoy what we do today is because people were able to move on and make things better.

Don't you think it's time to move on and make things better, as well? Remember, we've all been through what you are going through now. You are not the first person to discover the history of man. Tremendous improvements have been made with further to go, but these things don't happen overnight.

You've got to leave the past in the past. — synthesis

It's not forgetting the past. It's understanding it and then moving forward. The past is done. You cannot keep living it over and over again. That doesn't help anybody.

Believe it or not, most everybody is doing what they can on a personal level. The elite are doing their thing (doing whatever they can to win), the professional and administrative classes have unfortunately sold-out but that will eventually change when leadership arises, and everybody else is trying to get by.

It's not that you get it and nobody else does. Pretty much everybody gets it and is trying to do what they can (believe it or not). You act as if somehow you understand and nobody else does. Again, everybody gets it but you have to live with balance in your life because there are other people who might depend on you keep it together and act like a responsible adult.

Pretty much everybody gets it and is trying to do what they can (believe it or not). — synthesis

Silly me. You should have informed me of this from the start.

Correct. There is also a huge distinction between the past, and ongoing shit. Once the shit is over, we can think about moving on. Until then, we need to flush the toilet.

Life is one shit after the next.. You think you are just going to wave your magic wand and utopia will appear? You guys think you have finally figured it all out?

Boy are you going to be disappointed when you realize it's one shit storm after another after another after...

But that doesn't mean you can't enjoy life because there are wonderful parts that you have to make on your own. A good life is not available on Amazon with free 2-day shipping.

Life is one shit after the next.. — synthesis

Lost your zen already. :lol:

Zen is seeing things as they are, not as you "think" they are.

You have to first accept life as it is and then figure how you fit in. You guys see only the negative (and there is plenty of it) but there also a great deal of good and wonderful. Find the balance between the two and you'll be able to help the most people.

Life is one shit after the next.. — synthesis

I know that as well, or better than you. But we are not talking about one shit storm after the next. We are talking about the current, ongoing shit storm. The burden of proof is upon the shit to crawl out of the toilet and prove it is not shit. So, did you say I said something I did not say, or not? Are you a liar? Still waiting before engaging on the merits. See, it's not over, and you can't put it in the past just because it's convenient for you.

"The 'you lost, get over it' crowd from 2016 is now obsessivly checking ballots for imaginary bamboo particles because they lost and can't get over it." Jeff Tiedrich

I've got to admire your persistence but i don't want to chat about the election. It's over. Time to move on. And to tell you the truth, I don't even remember what we were talking about.

If you don't trust me, that's fine, but my take on lying is that it is a useless tactic. If that's not good enough for you, whatever. Find somebody else to chat with.

So you were lying about the shit? That’s shitty.

And to tell you the truth, I don't even remember what we were talking about. — synthesis

How convenient. See how that works? You step on your dick, and rather than take personal responsibility for your own actions, you just want to forget and move on.

If you don't trust me, that's fine, but my take on lying is that it is a useless tactic. — synthesis

You said I said something and even put me in quotes. I searched for it, could not find it, and begged you to show me where I said it. Why should I trust you? It's apparently not a useless tactic if you suck me back into the merits and then pull that shit again. It's par for the course with those who have squandered their credibility.

If that's not good enough for you, whatever. Find somebody else to chat with. — synthesis

I wasn't chatting with you. I responded to Praxis. You started chatting with me, and I called you out on your "apparently" disingenuous BS. So, if you don't like getting called out on your BS, and don't want to crawl out of the toilet and meet your burden of proof, re-establishing any credibility you might have, then you find somebody else to chat with.

You guys need to shop for a new narrative.

Might I suggest...

NewNarrativesForFormerLeftists.com ? I hear they've got a great selection of up-beat narratives. :)

I hope you guys can take a joke. You can't be THAT serious.

Might I suggest... — synthesis

Yes, after you re-establish credibility.

The fictional character that is synthesis doesn’t require credibility to function. :roll:

The fictional character that is synthesis doesn’t require credibility to function. :roll: — praxis

:100: Like so many institutions and individuals today. :worry:

If the left desires equality of outcome and you're against it that means that you desire inequality of outcome. — praxis

Equality of outcome is a lack of diversity. You can't have both equality and diversity. To achieve equality of outcomes, we'd all have to be genetically engineered and raised by the State.