Man's inhumanity to man.

Anopheles

This is just a relevant thought that has been passing through my mind for a short while now. Now more than ever I see division of people everywhere (in north America mostly). Political topics have spread to every facet of our lives as if everything is a right or wrong, black and white and so on.
Its crazy for me to see that in the name of the greater good of society and for the growth of so called equality and the eventual elimination of prejudice, all I ever see anyone do is put more labels on people which essentially throws us in more groups to be "the oppressed" or "the oppressor". The more of this I see, the more people seem to grow to hate rather than bringing anybody together.

As a young man with still a very raw, unfinished idea of how our world works, it pains me to see others my age marry there ideals so fast without question. I see true critical individual thinking as a rapidly dying virtue. In my opinion this can only lead to terrible outcomes.
Seemingly as far as the human race can be remembered, one has been in conquest over the other in the name of some narrative that has been given to them to believe without question. whether it be religion or whose skin looks more appealing. It always starts with someone thinking they just can because they are better in some way shape or form.

To me this is a world where no one is justified to claim they know anything, so why has humanity torn itself apart over and over again to define what is what and who is who? And for what?

Jack Cummins

↪Anopheles

I think that you are speaking about many forms of self destructiveness. I am concerned about the issues of prejudice and other injustices too. People call me an idealist, sometimes in criticism. But you are addressing the whole equation of collective injustice and I tend to see this in relation to what Jung describes as the shadow side of human nature, the repressed. I believe that this dark side is what is repressed and it forms as a powerful shadow in its own right.

Nikolas

To me this is a world where no one is justified to claim they know anything, so why has humanity torn itself apart over and over again to define what is what and who is who? And for what? — Anopheles

The answer is the acquired need for prestige. It takes the place of recognizing universal purpose. Prestige than offers us the feeling of value

"The combination of these two facts — the longing in the depth of the heart for absolute good, and the power, though only latent, of directing attention and love to a reality beyond the world and of receiving good from it — constitutes a link which attaches every man without exception to that other reality.

Whoever recognizes that reality recognizes also that link. Because of it, he holds every human being without any exception as something sacred to which he is bound to show respect.

This is the only possible motive for universal respect towards all human beings. Whatever formulation of belief or disbelief a man may choose to make, if his heart inclines him to feel this respect, then he in fact also recognizes a reality other than this world's reality. Whoever in fact does not feel this respect is alien to that other reality also." ~ Simone Weil

A person who recognizes the reality of this "other world," intuitively knows the futility of fighting for prestige when we are all equal in our nothingness and that we all need help.

Anopheles

The answer is the acquired need for prestige. It takes the place of recognizing universal purpose. Prestige than offers us the feeling of value — Nikolas

Is mans inherent flaw then to add value to nothing and place that value on themselves for gratification simply because we don't want to feel useless in a world with no definite purpose?

Anopheles

↪Jack Cummins

I'm not very well versed in his theories or Freud's for that matter. Do you think a collective can 100% be completely aware of its "shadow" and without complete destruction attempt to form to a level of social values?

Jack Cummins

↪Anopheles

It is hard work to gain awareness of the shadow because we all have a shadow side. He saw the work of the individual in coming to terms with all the negative aspects of the personality, and of course, he was working as a psychotherapist. I think it is worth you exploring his ideas if you are interested. You can probably find some further details about him on the internet, but most of my own reading has been his writings and many followers and critics. Jung's ideas, including the shadow are a big topic.

I am also aware that you wrote this thread shortly after I wrote mine on compassion and I do think that we are both looking at the same problem really. Also, you wrote about prejudice and if you scroll down the page of discussions you can see that I have a thread discussion going on prejudice, if you are interested.

Anopheles

↪Jack Cummins

I see. I will for sure check that out. Would you recommend any of Carl Jung's work as a must read?

Jack Cummins

↪Anopheles

There is so much. Probably the book I would recommend is 'Modern Man in Search for a Soul' is a good introduction to his ideas.

Nikolas

The answer is the acquired need for prestige. It takes the place of recognizing universal purpose. Prestige than offers us the feeling of value
— Nikolas

Is mans inherent flaw then to add value to nothing and place that value on themselves for gratification simply because we don't want to feel useless in a world with no definite purpose? — Anopheles

I meant that Man has forgotten his objective purpose so only success in his subjective purposes offer prestige and the feeling of value. A man may be a success in business which offers prestige without any awareness of the objective value of his "being" for universal needs.

A person can decide which form of life is worth preserving and defines its value without any awareness of what respect for the wholeness of life means. A woman may decide her fetus is worthless to her so lacks value and easily aborted. Yet another woman may consider the fetus she is carrying is very important to her so now has value and it would be against the law to kill it. But the objective question is the objective value of human being itself for universal needs. What purpose does it serve?

Judaka

↪Anopheles

The reason things are the way they are now is basically due to the news media. The main ways for people to "know" the world has been corrupted, the news is not there to inform but almost literally to support particular political views. The result is that based on the kinds of information sources you have, your worldview may be entirely reasonable and logical but since many of these sources are corrupted and manipulative, the end result is that people can't understand each other.

Pinprick

so why has humanity torn itself apart over and over again to define what is what and who is who? And for what? — Anopheles

In a word, insecurity. I would tentatively argue that we are biologically driven to be insecure. Insecurity spurs one to gather food for fear of starvation, to attack for fear of being attacked, to become tribal/conform for fear of excommunication. I’m convinced that as a whole we are helplessly insecure. No matter how much we have, or what we have, it isn’t enough. This could also be construed as a survival instinct, but it manifests as insecurity.

OneTwoMany

Best way to understand this is if you watch documentaries on monkeys and if you believe we have evolved from them. Monkey clans don't typically fight other species but they are ruthless with rival groups. All for territorial, food and mating rights. We see differences in each other, be it skin color, language, cultural practices and worst of all ideas, as a threat to our own being. But if we share a hobby with someone from a denomination we don't like, we make an exception, saying my buddy X though, he is alright. Find common ground, do things together, break bread together and everyone will be 'alright'.

baker

To me this is a world where no one is justified to claim they know anything — Anopheles

Most people disagree. So you're in the minority.

Valentinus

To me this is a world where no one is justified to claim they know anything, so why has humanity torn itself apart over and over again to define what is what and who is who? And for what? — Anopheles

Under those set of conditions, your question applies to your question along with any others. There is no separate place where humanity is explained outside of the standards we set for ourselves to attempt talking about it.

Are there any just wars? Now that is a question.

Man's inhumanity to man.

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