So, with free will, it's not something random, is it? — Terrapin Station
Uhhhh. What? You mean it's not something deterministic? — khaled
What did you do when you read that explanation? — Terrapin Station
What don't you understand here: — Terrapin Station
But. You have different probabilities to do things before this biasing takes place no? — khaled
It's not deterministic in that you're not forced to make a particular choice. — Terrapin Station
So, with free will, it's not something random, is it? — Terrapin Station
You're a determinist. I'm not. Obviously I don't believe that free will is "wishful thinking" I think that determinism is thinking that hasn't moved past about 1840. — Terrapin Station
So the sum total of your argument as to why we should not legislate against hate speech despite the clear correlation with violence is that hate speech cannot be a cause of violent action because violent action is actually caused by some magical force which we can't detect but you just 'reckon' is there. — Isaac
We don't even need that. — Terrapin Station
Except it IS something random no? — khaled
that hate speech cannot be a cause of violent action — Isaac
The biasing is not random--you don't have random contemplation about your possibilities. But it's not determined — Terrapin Station
you don't have random contemplation — Terrapin Station
Uhhhhh. Aren't you literally proposing the mystical third way of causation that we both said doesn't exist, this "free". Something is either ontologically determined or it is random. There is no room for "free" unless free means "not determined" in which case it means random. You said this yourself... — khaled
biasing the possibilities is something that you do. You control this. — Terrapin Station
And again--this is something else that I've had to repeat many times (which is incredibly annoying) when we're just talking about electrons and rocks and stuff, (a) I'm not a strong determinist, and (b) I'm not a realist on physical laws. — Terrapin Station
Yes — Terrapin Station
"You feel like you control this but it's actually just like every other physical interaction" seems more accurate to me. — khaled
but those are not deterministic — Terrapin Station
biased probabilities, etc., — Terrapin Station
then there's no distinction to be made — Terrapin Station
Random doesn't imply anything like "not controllable." Again, you bias the possibilities. You control this — Terrapin Station
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