While that sounds like a beautiful, selfless, noble desire to feel, it wasn't an experience of ego dissolution.

Oh okay :) Can you explain to me why you think that? I'd like to understand what the difference is between ego-death and the feeling I tried to describe.

i dont think you have to relate these feelings to a rigid high philosophy concept. I dont know anything about ego-death but i guess it s just a way of thinking, a mindset or a philosphy of life after some realizations. I think u simply want to be kind towards people perhaps because you weren't kind in the past, perhaps you have something you want to be forgiven.
whatever it is, this is a good thing and u do not have to wrry about, just flow in it if it makes u happy.

Oh okay :) Can you explain to me why you think that? I'd like to understand what the difference is between ego-death and the feeling I tried to describe.

I'll try my best. Ego dissolution involves the complete loss of ability to identify oneself introspectively. There’s a sense of disorientation and ‘groundlessness’ as you iteratively realize none of the mental objects, ‘thought stream’, ‘sensation of your buttock’ ‘sensation of your back leaning against a chair’ are actually, really ‘you’ and that there is no underlying stable, singular feeling you can concretely identify as yourself, just an expansive void.

Ego dissolution involves the complete loss of ability to identify oneself internally and a fragmentation, breaking apart of your internal self-representation. — aporiap

That's the Jungian understanding of the phrase. I believe Regi is talking about the Buddhist sense of it.



But, yes, in both senses you wouldn't have felt guilty about eating a piece of candy, and you wouldn't have talked to yourself, since you would no longer recognize yourself as one whole being separate from others. In the Buddhist sense you become "one" with the universe.

I'm not a Buddhist, but I know that Siddhartha went through something somewhat similar to what you describe before reaching ego-death in the mythology. He went through an intense phase of self-abnegation almost to the point of suicide. However, since the self it part of the universe, to inflict suffering on the self is to inflict suffering on the universe.

Hello Regi, thanks for your post. Interesting question, perhaps as a general question it is one of the perennial philosophical and spiritual mysteries.

I’m not a fan of naming it ego “death”, though I understand why many do so. Death is such an absolute word, so black or white. How about “ego-transcendence”? A knowledge that the ego does not equal the self, let alone anything beyond it. Maybe the ego has a valuable function in the human experience, even if it seems to be often imbalanced or over-emphasized. If one asked a dieting person how much they wanted to lose, none would say “all of it!!” Not unless they were joking, or perhaps depressed and suicidal. The same roughly applies to the ego, in my experience.

Perhaps you have read some authors who deal with Transpersonal Psychology. Basically and generally, they attempt to use science and reason to shed light on ancient spiritual practices and traditions. The Transpersonalists mostly act on the premise that there is something vital worth exploring in these practices, even if one is not a religious or even a particularly spiritual person. The prevalence and popularity of yoga is an example of this, though the tradition includes much more than hatha yoga with its asanas and exercises. The writings and lectures of Joseph Campbell may also be helpful here. As mentioned above, Buddhism almost specializes in this area, as does other traditions like Taoism.

There have been several threads on this forum, more or less dealing with this topic:
https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/1568/discarding-the-ego-as-a-way-to-happiness/p1
https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/190/is-my-happiness-more-important-than-your-happiness-egoism/p1
https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/842/the-nature-of-the-self-and-the-boundaries-of-the-individual/p1

Thanks again, and good luck. :up:

I believe Regi is talking about the Buddhist sense of it. — NKBJ

I don't think a Buddhist would consider handing out free candy a charitable or selfless act. The body processes it as a toxin.

That is the buddhist sense

Damned if I know what happened to you. Clearly your ego didn't die, dissolve, or ditch your body and depart. It sounds like a good thing, though, and I don't don't know what causes these sudden insights to appear. Such things are reported, and they don't seem to happen frequently in any person's life. It isn't abnormal; for a greater understanding you would need to search your own memories, your own history, to see what you had learned and experienced prior to this event. You MIGHT find some clues, or maybe not.

5 years ago... how has the event affected your thinking, feeling, and behavior since it happened? Do you consider the event spiritually important? If so, what guidance does it provide you?

Welcome to the Philosophy Forum!

When reading about ego-death, I remembered this feeling and it kind of described what happened back then.
Is this feeling I describe a brief ego-death? Is it even possible to randomly experience a brief period of ego-death without drugs? — Regi

I don't think the name of the experience matters, and no one is in the business of issuing certificates of authenticity. What happened was clearly possible, and it is unsurprising that you want more. But it is wanting more that ends it, so the way back is blocked. Now you have to take the long road of discipline, meditation, hard work and sacrifice. Good luck to you.

Buddhists like candy just fine

Here's a video of the dalai lama giving candy to a kid:
https://youtu.be/7YX7npkQSlA

no one is in the business of issuing certificates of authenticity.

There are definitely key, identifiable features of that experience that are missing in his description. Not at all to diminish or delegitimize the impact, but clearly it isn't the same

My mistake.

I should have said, "aporia is in the business of issuing certificates, but I wouldn't bother to apply."

lol. Honestly, I'm asking sincerely since it seems like a straight forward observation - what makes you say no one can reliably recognize an experience as one of a certain kind or not?

I stand corrected. :sad:

Thank you all for your responses, if what some of you describe is true, I didn't experience ego-death. Also, I shouldn't try to give it a name either.

I'm going to investigate what I was doing during the period of this experience, what my thoughts were. I will google about this (not searching for ego-death).
I've always asked myself alot of questions, I never stop wondering how my mind works and how to persue happiness. It's my life goal to search for happiness, and during this experience I felt like I found what I was looking for. The more I think about this experience, the more I can remember. I also remembered feeling like I had a purpose, and feeling that I understood what matters.

I will keep you updated, perhaps I can manage to find out what triggered this.

Thanks again for your effort to give me your best view on this experience, I feel very welcome to this forum !

I have experienced what you cal ego death on a few occasions. I do not believe it is healthy. I believe the human condition should strike a balance between the mind and spirit.

It is definitely possible to experience without drugs, but drugs do help especially hallucinogens like mushrooms.

I though 'ego death' was the experience of dissolving into an experience of one sensation - a total connected sensation consisting of no other color other than white light and no experience of 3 dimensional objects, including what was one's presumed personal body, and therefore also no sense of time.

Unpopular opinion: I think Ego death is a hoax and very dangerous spirituality designed for the person to loose their mind and become mentally unstable. There’s nothing wrong with having a sense of identity, and still be a selfless,kind person. When You’re stuck in limbo with confusion and anxiety during the ego death....that’s quite the opposite of peace and comfort. Sense of identity is your soul/spirit/energy. Not the ego! Your soul is constantly learning and changing for the better through life lessons. Why are you decimating yourself? You need to look deep inside your subconscious... if you feel something is very wrong and making you anxious then you are right....compare this to life situations...for example when you get a weird feeling about someone creepy and it turns out to be right, or when u feel your partner is cheating or whatever, you can tell with your subconscious something is very wrong and it appears as anxiety.... There is a reason why you are feeling anxious when you are experiencing “ego death” Bc it’s not right. Go with your gut. This is coming from a person who has experimented with drugs. You are also opening some spiritual doors that you should not mess with. There is some very real dark energy in the spiritual world waiting to possess you if you’re not careful. Some of you will probably not agree to this post but everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Just trying to help! Good luck on your journey.

It is as though you are completely dissolving away from the inside and you no longer have a sense of internal reference to a stable, singular self. So it's not a moral desire, it's something like a frightening, terrifyingly vivid realization of the fact that self is a manufactured entity. — aporiap

Seems like a good description, thanks for adding it. :up:

I experienced this unique feeling for 3 days if I remember correctly. On the fourth day, I bought a bag of bite-sized Snickers and ate it all myself, until I felt sick. — Regi

What about your experience impressed your self the most?

Sounds like my LSD experiences.

Throwback to this post about how LSD made me Jesus. Lol.

This is about to get really real:

2016 was a really intense year for me. Towards the end of 2015 I took it upon myself to give the trust enough in myself to start smoking pot and drinking again after 5 years of sobriety. (During that 5 years I was around parties allllll the time; I even organized them and got all of the people together to make them as big and beautiful as I could.) Everyone knew I was sober, but it didn't effect my relationships with my friends because they all knew that I try my hardest to be a loving and genuine person to everyone I meet.
But I started back...
The weed and the booze aren't what threw me for a loop, though. I am the type of person who can take one puff or drink one beer and then walk away and continue about my life like they are no big deal.
No... it wasn't addiction.
It was Hallucinogens.
I took some acid.
It gave me feelings like I had never before experienced. Physically, mentally, and emotionally something changed inside me and I became extremely curious as to what it was about these chemicals that opened up a whole new perspective of life in my mind.
So I indulged. Regularly.
Too regularly. My curiosity led to a habit of accepting almost any drug that crossed my path. (I even took meth once - NEVER again will I do that; it was absolutely horrendous.)
I never went out of my way to find these chemicals, but I did intentionally put myself in positions and situations where I knew that they would surface for my indulgence.
After a while... I felt enlightened from them. "Woke" as the kids say now a days...
But my "wokeness" went too far. It gave me a sense of superiority over others in a way. In my mind I could do no wrong because everything I chose to do was considered yet another part in my path towards... Well towards making the world a better place.
I became a saint in my own eyes.
It became my destiny to travel the world spreading love and peace to anyone who was willing to have it. At one point I was even considering spending my very last $1500 on a plane ticket to Israel. I was going to go and see whoever was in charge and I was going to end the Jerusalem conflict with my love. (Trust me I know it's silly lol)

Instead I left my family in Denver and I went off to Oregon with nothing. I offended the people I took shelter under with my self righteous delusions of grandeur. (much like I offended many with the same ideals before I even left home; many people have forgiven me, some haven't, and some I will likely ask forgivness of until I die because I have a hard time forgiving myself.)
Anyway - they kicked me out and I became homeless in Eugene Oregon with a heart full of love and a mind full of confusion. It was here that I found a feeling of desire and love for art. Homelessness is very boring at times and art kept me thrilled to be alive. Soon after, I realized that my greatest creation was at home without my guidance and without my affection, so I gave up my desire to change the world and traded it for a bus ticket home to be a presence for the greatest achievement that I will ever leave on Earth - my son.
This experience, and these chemicals changed my life. They took away the pressure of being the perfect human and they gave me the understanding that purpose is within - not without.

If you are experiencing a "third eye opening experience" from hallucinogens I want to say this: it is not your job to heal the world. Don't put that pressure on yourself. It is your job to find the peace in your own heart enough to accept your life as it happens. It's okay to feel "woke" but trust me - you do not want to be "the wokest" because there is a very fine line on the matter of morality and we just aren't capable of having all of the answers all of the time - no matter how genuine we feel in our hearts.

Fortunately I have had the year of 2017 to recover from this life changing experience. I no longer feel the curiosity that was brought about by the chemicals that I no longer take, and I don't feel the desire to dig deeper into this altered state of mind. I feel like I learned what I needed to learn, and thank God I don't need to learn it again.

I love you. I love life. I love my family and my son. We will put our minds to bringing prosperity to our home and we will win.

I want to say this: it is not your job to heal the world. — Lif3r

Or it is our job to heal the world, and we have to do it with a sober, sound mind.

I agree we have a duty to help to the best of our abilities. But what I mean to say is that when you fail to heal the entire world don't feel like a failure because we can only do as much as we can.

That's very true.

Not having a heart full of love I suppose, I read yours as a tale of irresponsibility, self indulgence, ironic arrogance (which still persists), and addiction, which led you to such epiphanies as you should be grateful, humble, sober, and you should care for your children. In your quest to save the world, as far as I can tell, you partied and annoyed people and now you share with us the wisdom of your journey.

I could have told you your train was going to derail from the get go, and I'm guessing a bunch of others told you that over and over and over and now you're here, letting us know they were right.

Do you have a job and are you up to date on your child support?

happily married, could make 55 an hour but I gave it up to follow a career that I enjoy more. Child lives with myself and mom.

Also... Actually.. No one told me that I was wrong, or explained to me that I was experiencing schizophrenic delusions as a result of using psychedelics. None of my other friends were experiencing these delusions. None of them sold their house and truck to be homeless. Just me. A couple of people did mention the term "God Complex" to me, but then they merely proceeded to make fun of me without further explanation. If someone had explained to me what I was experiencing I likely would have snapped out of it sooner as I managed to do as soon as I started researching the psychosis.