• creativesoul
    8.4k
    Moral intuitions or moral behaviors could be codified as rules; spoken or written. so I'm not seeing how morality is dependent upon language, except for its formulation as sets of written or spoken rules.Janus

    If morality - as a term - refers to codes of conduct, and all codes consist entirely of common language, then it only follows that so too does all moralities. It would also follow that whatever all common language consists of, so too does all morality. It would also follow that whatever all common language is existentially dependent upon, so too is all morality.

    My suspicion is that you're using the term "moral" in two different ways here. Sometimes as a value judgment similar to "good" or "right", or "worthy of assent", and other times as naming practice for anything and everything that is based upon - or a manifestation of - keeping others interest/benefit in mind.

    I don't think we're too far apart here.

    There's still much headway to make, on my part, concerning the overall thread. Much ground to cover.
  • Janus
    9.2k
    Morality is more than rule writing.creativesoul

    I agree.

    ...but it is not enough to be called "moral" unless all wants and needs and all consideration thereof also counts.creativesoul

    Not sure what you are driving at here.

    My suspicion is that you're using the term "moral" in two different ways here.creativesoul

    There are two issues in what you say in the post the above is quoted from

    First, there is your statement that 'morality' as a term, refers only to codes of conduct. I agree that is one of its senses.

    Second, you identify a distinction you think I am emphasizing between morality as judgement and morality as process of feeling, deliberation and action. I accept the distinction, but I was only concerned with the latter.
  • creativesoul
    8.4k


    If morality - as a term - refers to codes of conduct, and all codes consist entirely of common language, then it only follows that so too does all moralities. It would also follow that whatever all common language consists of, so too does all morality. It would also follow that whatever all common language is existentially dependent upon, so too is all morality.creativesoul

    That which consists of something else cannot exist prior to that something else. Codes of conduct consist of common language. Codes of conduct cannot exist prior to common language. Morality consists of codes of conduct. Morality cannot exist prior to codes of conduct. Morality cannot exist prior to common language. Common language consists of thought and belief statements. Common language cannot exist prior to thought and belief statements. Morality cannot exist prior to thought and belief statements.

    That which consists of something else is existentially dependent upon that something else. Morality consists of codes of conduct. Morality is existentially dependent upon codes of conduct. Codes of conduct consist of common language. Codes of conduct are existentially dependent upon common language. Morality is existentially dependent upon common language. Common language consists of thought and belief statements. Morality is existentially dependent upon thought and belief statements.

    That which is existentially dependent upon something else cannot exist prior to that something else. Codes of conduct are existentially dependent upon common language. Codes of conduct cannot exist prior to common language. Common language is existentially dependent upon thought and belief statements. Common language cannot exist prior to thought and belief statements. Morality is existentially dependent upon common language. Morality cannot exist prior to thought and belief statements.

    So, we've arrived at the irrevocably important role that thought and belief play here, in morality.

    Thought and belief statements consist of correlations drawn between different things, as all thought and belief do. Statements thereof involve naming and descriptive practices(common language use), and are of a more complex kind as a result of including language use as an integral part of the aforementioned correlations. Morality cannot exist prior to thought and belief statements, but it seems to me - and I suspect you'll readily agree - that morality is also existentially dependent upon whatever thought and belief statements are also dependent upon. Morality would also consist of whatever thought and belief statements consist of, which brings us to the parts of morality that are not existentially dependent upon language, but are irrevocably important elements nonetheless.

    Prelinguistic thought and belief. Here, is perhaps where the intuitionist's basis can be found, and on a universally applicable and/or extant way... rather than just being relative to individual particulars.

    That which exists prior to something else cannot be existentially dependent upon that something else. Some thought and belief is prior to common language use, and thus prior to all codes of conduct.

    Here is where we find the need to distinguish between morality, and what's universally relevant to it. Perhaps then, we can establish some true statements about morality that are universal.

    :wink:

    Moral intuition, I suspect, is founded upon(consists of) such morally relevant prelinguistic universal thought and belief.
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