So in a world where the apple does not exist, the haecceity "being that apple" exists, and is unexemplified. — Banno
Several ideas are introduced here, one being to obtain. — frank
Both parts are "from the viewpoint of a mind". — Metaphysician Undercover
So there is no way that we can get to the conclusion that the people in an imaginary world have a real and actual perspective. — Metaphysician Undercover
Well, Homer is the author of the Iliad and the Odyssey. So presumable "Homer" designates that person whoever he may be. — Ludwig V
The place signified "Chicago" is not an imaginary thing, it is understood as real, actual. — Metaphysician Undercover
In the case of possible worlds, they are imaginary things, not real or actual, but possible. — Metaphysician Undercover
At any rate, anyone who chooses to take possible world analysis seriously ought to understand the dependency on coherence theory of truth. — Relativist
Determinism only blocks alternative futures for this world, not alternative worlds altogether. — Banno
So is the name "Homer" a rigid designator in this case? — Ludwig V
The identity of "Homer" is a mystery, and scholars generally regard the ancient conception of a single author behind the Iliad and the Odyssey as a fictional narrative
One puzzling consequence of Kripke semantics is that identities involving rigid designators are necessary. If water is H2O, then water is necessarily H2O.
In modal logic and the philosophy of language, a term is said to be a rigid designator or absolute substantial term when it designates the same thing in all possible worlds in which that thing exists.
What you learnt about Aristotle enables you to refer to Aristotle — Ludwig V
Scott Soames: In the philosophy of language, Naming and Necessity is among the most important works ever, ranking with the classical work of Frege in the late nineteenth century, and of Russell, Tarski and Wittgenstein in the first half of the twentieth century
We produce a fictional idea, a possibility, then to make it fit within the possible worlds semantics, we assign concrete existence to it. — Metaphysician Undercover
Therefore the description is of what the concrete possible world is like, not of what it could be like. — Metaphysician Undercover
That's a very significant connection. Don't you think so? — Metaphysician Undercover
A name is not like a tag, though a tag is, in some ways, very like a name. — Ludwig V
I find that remark almost impossible to understand. Such understanding as I have of it rests on my knowledge of who and what Aristotle is. — Ludwig V
I've puzzled about this a great deal. Can you explain the difference to me? — Ludwig V
If a person like me, in this concrete world can describe another concrete world, then I must have some access to it, and it cannot be absolutely separate. — Metaphysician Undercover
The spatial temporal conditions of one must be similar to the spatial temporal conditions of the other, implying that there is a connection between them. — Metaphysician Undercover
Another way to ask this: what is it that establishes the truth of the statement, "there is a possible world in which Hobbits, Trolls and Orcs exist"? — Relativist
Robert De Beaugrande and Wolfgang U. Dressler define coherence as a "continuity of senses" and "the mutual access and relevance within a configuration of concepts and relations".[1] Thereby a textual world is created that does not have to comply to the real world. But within this textual world the arguments also have to be connected logically so that the reader/hearer can produce coherence.
But I might just suggest that there does not appear to be any reason to think there must be One True Account of reference - there may be many ways in which we can use a proper name. — Banno
This cannot be correct. If each possible world is separate from every other, in an absolute sense, then there would be no point to considering them, as they'd be completely irrelevant. — Metaphysician Undercover
If there is no causal connection sometime in history, in what sense are they possible? — Relativist
This cannot be correct. If each possible world is separate from every other, in an absolute sense, then there would be no point to considering them, as they'd be completely irrelevant. — Metaphysician Undercover
Perhaps the biggest — if not the most philosophically sophisticated — challenge to Lewis's theory is “the incredulous stare”, i.e., less colorfully put, the fact that its ontology is wildly at variance with common sense.
Contradictory propositions cannot both be true 'at the same time and in the same sense. I was responding to your statement that the propositions needed context. — Relativist
How would we be able to communicate, and make sense of the things around us, when contradictory things would be true for each of us? — Metaphysician Undercover
Certain characteristics belong with an individual in every possible world in which it exists. This account of essence is quite different to scholastic notions, but has many advantages, not the least being a clear definition. — Banno
But if the sun is actually shining, then although you don't know this fact, it is physically, metaphysically, and logically impossible for the sun to not be shining at that point of time. (Law of noncontradiction). — Relativist
Yet another issue: is the sun shining at that point of time a contingent fact, or a necessary fact? — Relativist
Wikipedia
Determinism is the metaphysical view that all events within the universe can occur only in one possible way.
Indeterminism is the idea that events are not caused, or are not caused deterministically. It is the opposite of determinism and related to chance.
But Lewis' interpretation appears to be that each possible world "is" an actual world. — Metaphysician Undercover
And yet all these people can communicate. How is that possible? There must be common elements to all these different meanings that enable communication across contexts. Those common elements are what we might call ordinary life, which is the common context that links all three people. — Ludwig V
There is an implied difference between the perceived world and the imaginary worlds, but both those categories are actual, so "actual" serves no purpose. — Metaphysician Undercover
What meaning does "actual" have here? You could remove it from your example without changing the meaning of anything. — Metaphysician Undercover
Well, you/Kripke have your reasons for saying that, I suppose. But it is clear that whatever "water" means is not based on that information. — Ludwig V
Again, perhaps so. But it follows that, whoever is called Aristotle is not necessarily the philosopher that we know and love. — Ludwig V
as Berkeley pointed out, unless you can compare a representation with its original, you can't establish what, if anything, it is a representation of. — Ludwig V
The implication is that the existence of the causal chain is necessary and sufficient, presumably whether or not we know it. That's extremely hard to understand, because it suggests that we do not necessarily know who Aristotle is, if anyone. — Ludwig V
But all possible worlds are possible actual worlds. — Ludwig V
In standard modal logic there is exactly one actual world………………………We've a set of possible worlds, W, and we can label any one of these the actual world, w₀.
In standard modal logic there is exactly one actual world..........................We've a set of possible worlds, W, and we can label any one of these the actual world, w₀. — Banno
Importantly, accessibility is not causal, temporal, or epistemic unless specified. And it can be so specified. It constrains what worlds we have access to. — Banno
So he's saying an individual is essentially tied to particular features of its origin in a way that it is not essentially tied to particular features of its subsequent history. Further, he's saying that origin is a necessary condition, not a necessary and sufficient condition. — Relativist
The reasoning is inescapably circular! It starts with the assumption an object is the same object in a (non-actual) possible world (it has a trans-world identity) and then conclude that the object must have an essence that accounts for it being the same object. — Relativist
I don't see how actual world could only possible exist — Ludwig V
You left out the other condition, "pain" must refer to everything as well. If pain refers to everything, as "actual" refers to all possible worlds, and there is no definition for "pain", then it's meaningless. — Metaphysician Undercover
The concept of "quark" misleads intellectually, by producing the illusion that something not understood is understood. — Metaphysician Undercover
Even the experience of our perceptions must be put into descriptive words before it becomes a part of the modal model. If the modal model is "the actual", then our perceptions are not. — Metaphysician Undercover
The reasoning is inescapably circular! — Relativist
Kripke's theory of naming, presented in his book "Naming and Necessity," argues against the descriptivist theory of names, proposing instead that names refer to objects through a causal chain originating from an initial act of naming. This means that a name's reference is fixed by its original use, rather than by a set of descriptive properties associated with the name.
Sure, but in the situation we're talking about every possible world is actual, and there's no definition as to what actual means. So "actual" is meaningless. — Metaphysician Undercover
Then there is the source of my empirical experience, which is not one of the possible worlds (as these are what are in the model), therefore not actual. So I concluded that it is an illusion. — Metaphysician Undercover
No, the actual world we live in is not actual, the possible worlds are actual. — Metaphysician Undercover
OK, but then "actual" has no real meaning. The world we live in isn't distinct as "the actual world", all the possible worlds are actual worlds, and there is no point to calling the world we live in "the actual world", because it's just one of many, which are more properly called possible worlds. — Metaphysician Undercover
That the world I live in and provides my empirical experience is "the actual world" must be an illusion........................Now this produces the age old metaphysical question of why do I experience this world, and not some other......................But we still have the same sort of question, why am I in this world, not in one of those others. — Metaphysician Undercover
If all the possible worlds are equally "actual", how could one be presupposed and the others theoretical? Doesn't this give unequal status to their actuality? — Metaphysician Undercover
I didn't see that coming! — frank
SEP - Possible Worlds
Furthermore, because worlds are (plausibly) defined entirely in nonmodal terms, the truth conditions provided by Lewis's translation scheme themselves appear to be free of any implicit modality. Hence, unlike many other popular accounts of possible worlds (notably, the abstractionist accounts discussed in the following section), Lewis's promises to provide a genuine analysis of the modal operators.
Yes that's exactly the problem. What we know as the independent, physical world, source of empirical observations, can no longer be accepted as such. It gets barred off as a sort of unreal illusion, and what we're left with is an extreme idealism where the ideas (possible worlds) are the reality. — Metaphysician Undercover
Wikipedia - Direct and Indirect Realism
Indirect perceptual realism is broadly equivalent to the scientific view of perception that subjects do not experience the external world as it really is, but perceive it through the lens of a conceptual framework
SEP - Phenomenology (Philosophy)
The epoché is Husserl's term for the procedure by which the phenomenologist endeavors to suspend commonsense and theoretical assumptions about reality (what he terms the natural attitude) in order to attend only to what is directly given in experience. This is not a skeptical move; reality is never in doubt.
SEP - Possible Worlds
His theory of worlds, he acknowledges, “does disagree, to an extreme extent, with firm common sense opinion about what there is” (1986, 133). However, Lewis argues that no other theory explains so much so economically.
SEP - Possible worlds
Furthermore, because worlds are (plausibly) defined entirely in non-modal terms, the truth conditions provided by Lewis's translation scheme themselves appear to be free of any implicit modality…………………Lewis's promises to provide a genuine analysis of the modal operators.
True, although isn't there an extra conundrum with direct realism: that if it's true, then it must be false (by virtue of what we observe about how the senses work). — frank
The problem being that the possible worlds model produces a separation between the possible worlds and the actual ontological world. Then one has to be selected as the real. — Metaphysician Undercover
SEP - Possible Worlds
But, for the concretist, other possible worlds are no different in kind from the actual world
As a science fiction fan, the idea of modal realism doesn't seem all that strange. — frank
His theory of worlds, he acknowledges, “does disagree, to an extreme extent, with firm common sense opinion about what there is” (1986, 133). However, Lewis argues that no other theory explains so much so economically. SEP Possible Worlds
