Comments

  • I'm paying for counselling over this, please help
    It's even a narrow approach of eating. Eating can also be more than just the relief of hunger. It can be a social activity, where we share food or an aesthetic exercise when we don't eat food to relieve hunger but to appreciate something new or because we like a particular flavour.Benkei

    Yes, but my point was even when it's for relief of hunger you wouldn't call it an expression of hunger.
  • I'm paying for counselling over this, please help


    Here is the inconsistency, building on and incorporating what you've said and agreed to:

    1) Eating food relieves Hunger. Hunger is physiological, not an emotion. Therefor, Eating food is not expression.

    2) Kissing relieves lust (can be a fulfillment of it, or one mechanism that leads to its fulfillment etc.).Lust is physiological. Therefor, by your logic, kissing should not be expression, but you said it *is* expression.

    Anyhow guys, and girls :), I'm writing to say thank you all so much for your contributions. You've really helped. The last couple of days I've been able to kiss and feel love again whilst doing so. I had to get at the root of the issue to do this, but your posts definitely helped. I hope it stays that way. I think I'm 95% there in finally overcoming all of my depersonalization symptoms after dealing with them for over 3 years. It seems too good to be true. I'm so grateful to God, and to everyone that's ever helped me, including you intelligent folk.
  • I'm paying for counselling over this, please help
    Ahaa, see, this is what's confusing me. You've said lust is physiological (Like hunger). You said a kiss could be a fulfillment of lust (Like food is a fulfillment of hunger). You also said kissing is an expression. But you refused to say eating food is an expression. There's an inconsistency here.

    I'll get back to you gents asap.
  • I'm paying for counselling over this, please help
    ahaa, so I think this is why my mind is having trouble. So you don't define hunger as an emotion then. Well what about lust (which is linked with buildup of semen). Do you define that as an emotion or a physiological need like hunger?
  • I'm paying for counselling over this, please help
    Hmmm my brain hurts and I can't quite articulate my concern. Just intuitively I feel like something's missing to complete my understanding. Ok, answer me this, would you say the action of eating is an expression? Could be Expression of hunger, boredom etc., but would you classify it as "expression" ?? Also, could you comment on the question/example I provided in my previous post here:
    To compare this with another action, if filled with lust and compelled to touch and run your hands all over your partner, would you classify doing that as an expression of desire OR as a fulfillment of it?? In this case I see it more as a fulfillment due to the physical/sexual pleasure of touch, and I suppose inevitably it would bean expression too?DP Brah

    And when I say fulfillment, I don't define it the same way you do, I define it as how eating food fulfills hunger.


    And by the way, I'm not analyzing kissing because Im frightened as you theorized, it just happens to be something I'm analyzing, I've done it for over 3 years now when my depersonalization began, my brain just picks at things randomly, It all started with "humor", I solved it and theorized the benign violation theory not knowing it already existed, and it just went from one random emotion/action/interaction to another, and now it's kissing.


    Hmm, again, I pose the same questions to you, would you classify eating as an expression? Also, what about lustfully touching and running your hands all over your partner's body, would you call that expression too? I think your answers to these will finally complete my understanding.
  • I'm paying for counselling over this, please help
    Ok, you're saying kissing is an expression. This is all Im trying to verify actually. Is it merely expression? You said if I kiss the lips or other parts of the body it is an expression of sexual desire. My question is, is it an expression of sexual desire or fulfillment of it? Am I merely communicating to my partner that I like this part of your body where I kiss it or am I actually "consuming" it in a way, via touch, via proximity etc.( I dunno just speculating). To compare this with another action, if filled with lust and compelled to touch and run your hands all over your partner, would you classify doing that as an expression of desire OR as a fulfillment of it?? In this case I see it more as a fulfillment due to the physical/sexual pleasure of touch, and I suppose inevitably it would bean expression too? But at least I can clearly see it being a fulfilment of sexual desire, whereas with kissing it's not so clear to me..

    I have depersonalization. Have had it for over 3 years. I respect your opinion, and actually agree with you to a large extent. But I waited over 6 months before making a thread like this. And ive actually benefited so far.

    Nicely put sir, I pose the same question to you as I did to timeline, is kissing merely an expression of emotion, or a means of sexual/physiological fullfillment??
  • I'm paying for counselling over this, please help
    But I'm not talking about a lip on lip kiss. I'm talking about kiss on cheek, hand/forhead/neck/breasts etc.

    Well no good sir, there's more to it, but it's a long story, and I dont want to bother people with it. Ultimately, I agree with your sentiment, but dropping an obsession is so much easier said than done, and due to my obsessive thoughts surrounding kissing, and not having a satisfying answer, Ive not been able to kiss and feel love for over 6 months. Its torture. Everytime I feel urged to kiss or even see the action of kissing anywhere Im immediately triggered into obsessive thinking and am pulled out of the moment. And because I cant find a solution to "kissing" I am rendered numb because I feel like I don't understand it.
  • What's the best way to get in touch with a reputable philosopher?
    lol!!

    Thanks for your insights, very helpful.

    Thanks to everyone else for contributing, your help is much appreciated.
  • What are we doing when we kiss our object of desire/affection?
    yea, it sucks man, I don't enjoy thinking about these things, i just can't help it.
  • What are we doing when we kiss our object of desire/affection?
    I wish it were that simple. My username might give you some indication. Long story short, I have depersonalization (DP), what comes with that is Pure O, and the nature of my obsessions revolve around.. well, the nature of everything. First it was nature of reality, then humor, and now it's sexuality. I analyze absolutely everything that has to do with human emotions and interactions to the core, even stuff like giving hi-fives, I'll think about, like what's that about.. you know? So yea, hope that explains more.
  • What are we doing when we kiss our object of desire/affection?
    friend, it has nothing to do with my sexual desires.. if you wish to better understand my intentions, we can discuss privately. This has nothing to do with fetishes or repressed sexual desires. It just so happens that what I'm analyzing at the moment happens to be of sexual/romantic nature.
  • What are we doing when we kiss our object of desire/affection?
    you said: "the 'body kiss' is full of self rather than connection.."

    full of self from who's perspective? The one that is kissing, or the one that is being kissed?
  • What are we doing when we kiss our object of desire/affection?
    Agreed, which is why I'm asking for your insight on the matter in the terms I've presented. Also, I'm mostly talking about subconscious motivations here, not conscious ones.



    I appreciate your response. I'm not concerned with the origins, but more so what the action is all about, again in the terms I presented (meaning is it a more selfless/giving action or selfish/taking action, in the context I provided).



    This is kissing mouth to mouth only, which is not something I have any doubts over. It's clear to me that kissing a sexy/beloved girl on the mouth would be very physically pleasurable to me and hence my motivations for kissing mouth to mouth in most contexts would be more selfish/taking.



    Interesting. Makes sense about the lip to lip pleasure, but whatabout say kissing a girl's neck.. or shoulder or stomach or breasts or ass.. who is receiving more physical pleasure from this action, the guy that is kissing those bodyparts or the girl that is being kissed? ( its probably both, but if you had to pick one, which who would it be?)



    Have I? What are my answers then coz I dont know, lol
  • What are we doing when we kiss our object of desire/affection?
    *sigh* well sir, I can't completely help it to be honest. It's a long story but this is what I do and what I've done for the last 3 years or so.. analyze and create theories from one thing to another. Once I'm fixated on something I can't move on or shake it from my mind until I've resolved it.

    The first thing I ever analyzed was humor. I actually formed the Benign Violation Theory on my own, and then came to realize that it already exists.

    Anyways yea.. I would appreciate your insight on the matter of kissing, in the terms I've presented thus far, if you would be so kind.
  • What are we doing when we kiss our object of desire/affection?


    Haha, wow pretty interesting..

    Give it attention you say.. so would you say kissing is more a selfless/giving type action? (such as say, giving someone a gift, or cooking them a meal, or praising them etc.) as opposed to a more selfish/taking type action such as in the example I gave in the OP where I'm touching my partner's breasts driven by my own physical pleasure?
  • Who is the beneficiary in this scenario?


    First, I'd like to thank every single one of you for your contributions, and apologize for being absent this long. I was abruptly sent offshore, and had no access to internet, but I've finally returned to civilization.

    As cavacava pointed out, I've stipulated a scenario and would like others to answer based on the scenario provided. I'm not debating at all that there is only one beneficiary in the interactions presented. In fact, I believe it is mostly always the case that both parties are beneficiaries albeit in different ways.



    Hanover, no, I'm not trying to decipher personality or value traits based on the answers. I know you said, you can't provide an answer to each scenario based on the example provided, but I invite you try. Go with your guts feeling and Guess if you must. Pretend that you had to. Again, basing your answer on the scenario stipulated. Think about it.

    I said I would reveal more, and while I did not plan to do so immediately, a lot of time has passed already so I will. The goal here for me, is not to try and interpret personality based on your answers. What I'm trying to do is construct a model which explains the action of "kissing". I understand there might be other models out there, but I'm trying to come up with one myself which satisfies me. Your answers will influence my thinking and constructing of this model. You might not see the connection, but I will reveal more about my model in due time.

    Just for your information, you may or may not find this interesting, but I actually came up with the Benign Violation Theory on my own. (Which relates to philosophy of humor; this theory is one of few which explains humor) I have a nag for this.. sometimes I can't help but deconstruct a certain action or reaction or emotion or interaction and create models and theories to explain what's going on, and right now, my object of analysis and deconstruction is "kissing".